Europe’s Biggest Cave Now World's Second Longest

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Europe’s Biggest Cave Now World's Second Longest

Postby Cheryl Jones » May 16, 2008 10:46 am

Bulgarians mapping Europe’s biggest cave
12:25 Tue 13 May 2008 - Elitsa Grancharova

Bulgarian speleologists have discovered a new gallery in the Optymistychna Cave in western Ukraine, enough to help it reclaim the second spot in the list of the world's longest caves, private broadcaster bTV reported on May 13......

.......Added to the current 220km, Optymistychna, also known as Optimisticeskaja after the Russian spelling of its name, is now more than 270km long, taking the distinction of the world second longest cave from the Jewel Cave in South Dakota. Only the Mammoth Cave in Kentucky is bigger.

http://www.sofiaecho.com/article/bulgar ... 8/catid_70
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Re: Europe’s Biggest Cave Now World's Second Longest

Postby Anonymous_Coward » May 16, 2008 11:21 am

Are we to believe that they have mapped 50 km of cave in less than a month? Quite impressive if it is true. I would like to hear from Alexander Klimchouk or someone else as reputable before this is taken as fact. We have gotten bad information from Ukraine before, and this news is coming from Bulgaria.
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Re: Europe’s Biggest Cave Now World's Second Longest

Postby Ralph E. Powers » May 16, 2008 9:52 pm

167.770 miles... yeah I guess that'd do it alright.
You know they're going to be pushing Jewel Cave even harder now to win back it's place. :big grin:

Kewl stuff.
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Europe’s Biggest Cave...NOT!

Postby Pat Kambesis » May 17, 2008 10:05 pm

I asked Alexander Klimchouk about this report as he usually knows whats going on in that part of the world...first hand. Here is his reply:

PK> Is this confirmed?

No, it is not.

According to unformal reports on the Ukrainian caving scene, the Lviv
club explores some new parts in the distant regions of the cave
(bulgarians were part of these efforts). New additions to the map are
about 1.2 km so far.

The bulgarian news is certainly a hoax, - unfortunately quite common
nowadays. Some people and groups are concerned only about sound media
outcome, not about correctness and their own reputation..

>"The Bulgarian expedition, which included nine speleologists, arrived
in Ukraine on April 25 and spent seven days underground together with
local colleagues, researching the cave and discovering 50km of
previously unmapped terrain."

>"Together with our Russian colleagues.."

This piece is full of misinformation. First, the bulgarians were
participating the regular expedition of the Lviv cavers (Ukrainians,
not Russians). Second, it is impossible to "discover 50km of ...
unmapped terrain." Number comes from mapping.. To map 50km in
the conditions of this cave, it would take 2-3 years of an intense
work (10-20 expeditions) at the best..
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Re: Europe’s Biggest Cave Now World's Second Longest

Postby martin » May 26, 2008 4:22 am

For more information about the second longest cave, please write to my e-mail adress: mtranteev@abv.bg
Martin Tranteev - head of bulgarian grupe in expedition
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Re: Europe’s Biggest Cave Now World's Second Longest

Postby Anonymous_Coward » May 26, 2008 1:50 pm

Martin,

If you have information that substantiates Optimistychna as the world's second longest cave, please post it here. That way it will be plain to all, not just those that bother to email you.

Most American cavers have come to regard Alexander Klimchouk as the authority on all matters Speleo-Ukranian. So we will be obliged to believe him that your claim is a hoax unless you can prove otherwise. Please understand that I am not taunting you or calling you a liar. It's just that this is not the first time we have heard wild claims of length come from Opti. These have been proven false after lots of confusion and discussion. We tend to regard the list that the NSS Geo2 committee maintains as the authority on cave length, over the claims of a Bulgarian newspaper. Unless you can explain how Optimistychna went from 228 km to 270 km in one week, I remain confident that the world's second longest cave is in South Dakota, USA.
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Re: Europe’s Biggest Cave Now World's Second Longest

Postby Ralph E. Powers » May 26, 2008 3:04 pm

jaa45993 wrote:Martin,

If you have information that substantiates Optimistychna as the world's second longest cave, please post it here. That way it will be plain to all, not just those that bother to email you.

Most American cavers have come to regard Alexander Klimchouk as the authority on all matters Speleo-Ukranian. So we will be obliged to believe him that your claim is a hoax unless you can prove otherwise. Please understand that I am not taunting you or calling you a liar. It's just that this is not the first time we have heard wild claims of length come from Opti. These have been proven false after lots of confusion and discussion. We tend to regard the list that the NSS Geo2 committee maintains as the authority on cave length, over the claims of a Bulgarian newspaper. Unless you can explain how Optimistychna went from 228 km to 270 km in one week, I remain confident that the world's second longest cave is in South Dakota, USA.


Well lets be fair and say that possibly their survey data must be off. Sometimes that happens ... even amongst the best of surveyors.
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Re: Europe’s Biggest Cave Now World's Second Longest

Postby martin » Aug 29, 2008 2:39 am

Ralph E. Powers wrote:
jaa45993 wrote:Martin,

If you have information that substantiates Optimistychna as the world's second longest cave, please post it here. That way it will be plain to all, not just those that bother to email you.

Most American cavers have come to regard Alexander Klimchouk as the authority on all matters Speleo-Ukranian. So we will be obliged to believe him that your claim is a hoax unless you can prove otherwise. Please understand that I am not taunting you or calling you a liar. It's just that this is not the first time we have heard wild claims of length come from Opti. These have been proven false after lots of confusion and discussion. We tend to regard the list that the NSS Geo2 committee maintains as the authority on cave length, over the claims of a Bulgarian newspaper. Unless you can explain how Optimistychna went from 228 km to 270 km in one week, I remain confident that the world's second longest cave is in South Dakota, USA.


Well lets be fair and say that possibly their survey data must be off. Sometimes that happens ... even amongst the best of surveyors.




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Re: Europe’s Biggest Cave Now World's Second Longest

Postby martin » Dec 8, 2008 4:55 pm

Dear colleages,
after two expeditions in the new part of "Optimistichna", the cave is 227,730 km long !
“Optimistichna” now is the second longest cave in the world !
And another - do you know that in Ukraine exist from three years - two speleo associations. The one is Ukraine Speleo Asociation with
president A.Klimchuk and the another one - West Ukraine Regional Union, who unify 16 ukrain speloclubs
and this union was created to explore the cave giants in West Ukraine.This union is a creater on projekts,
motor of the discovery now and for future discovers on this part of the world.
If you need more information
for West Ukraine, you must write to the president of West Ukraine Regional Union or the president of speleoclub "Ziklop" Lviv. They decides the problems on the research in "Optimistichna".
I wish you great luck .
Happy New Year!!! :grin:
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Re: Europe’s Biggest Cave Now World's Second Longest

Postby SDcaver » Dec 9, 2008 10:30 am

Sorry Martin, but Jewel Cave is currently just over 230 km long and therefore still the second longest cave in the world.
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Re: Europe’s Biggest Cave Now World's Second Longest

Postby SDcaver » Dec 9, 2008 11:16 am

I stand corrected- Jewel Cave is now at 231.5 km long. The park always has the current cave length posted on their website if you are ever curious- www.nps.gov/jeca/
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Re: Europe’s Biggest Cave Now World's Second Longest

Postby martin » Jan 14, 2009 3:24 pm

The "Optimisticheska cave" in this moment is a 230,140 km
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Re: Europe’s Biggest Cave Now World's Second Longest

Postby Chads93GT » Jan 15, 2009 11:05 pm

Martin, I do believe you need to learn what the comma is, and what its correct use is.

After all, A cave that is 230,140 km long would be 143002.36 miles long, and thats just a little bit bigger than Mammoth Cave.

:banana: :banana: :banana:
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Re: Europe’s Biggest Cave Now World's Second Longest

Postby Rick Brinkman » Jan 15, 2009 11:39 pm

Europeans often use the comma as 'our' decimal point.

Congrats on your finds in Optimisticheska!!!
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Re: Europe’s Biggest Cave Now World's Second Longest

Postby Chads93GT » Jan 16, 2009 12:26 am

Oh well my bad. I was going to say.........thats a LONG cave ;)
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