Another rescue in progress at Utah's Nutty Putty Cave

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Re: Another rescue in progress at Utah's Nutty Putty Cave

Postby chezdebs » Nov 26, 2009 8:17 pm

On behalf of New Zealand Cavers, I'd like to extend our heart felt sympathy for the lose of John Jones. We know everyone will be feeling very upset. It's a tough job and you all must be absolutely gutted!. Please pass on our thoughts to everyone. Kind regards Debbie Cade New Zealand Speleological Society.
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Re: Another rescue in progress at Utah's Nutty Putty Cave

Postby VACaver » Nov 26, 2009 8:52 pm

Thanks to everyone for their efforts.
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Re: Another rescue in progress at Utah's Nutty Putty Cave

Postby pub » Nov 26, 2009 9:07 pm

News-Leader.com reports with an AP article, Utah family struggles to make sense of cave death:
JENNIFER DOBNER wrote:...Cave access manager, Michael Leavitt said the Jones group had a pass and were experienced cavers, based on the information provided on a pass application.

"They've never been to Nutty Putty before, but they toured many harder caves in the Logan area that required vertical climbing skills," said Leavitt, one of dozens of cavers who volunteered with the rescue effort. "They were qualified, John was qualified. I'm sure he went into this passage hoping it was going to open up into one of the larger rooms."
Last edited by pub on Nov 27, 2009 4:34 am, edited 1 time in total.
Balincaguin comes from the Zambal phrase, "Bali lan caguing" meaning "house of bats."
This was the former name of the Municipality of Mabini, Pangasinan, when it was part of the Province of Zambales (of Mt. Pinatubo Volcano fame).
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Re: Another rescue in progress at Utah's Nutty Putty Cave

Postby Leitmotiv » Nov 26, 2009 11:06 pm

I think this puts an emphasis on knowing one's own limits before going into a cave or passage you've never done before. I don't know how one would train for a -70 degree crack 18 inches wide though.

I also noted that they had difficulty maneuvering around the formations. Were there formations in Bob's Push? Or was it just in further back toward the entrance? Would formations still be spared in such a dire circumstance?
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Re: Another rescue in progress at Utah's Nutty Putty Cave

Postby Caverdale » Nov 26, 2009 11:20 pm

Leitmotiv wrote:I also noted that they had difficulty maneuvering around the formations. Were there formations in Bob's Push? Or was it just in further back toward the entrance? Would formations still be spared in such a dire circumstance?

This "formation" was not a speleothem, of which this cave is nearly devoid. It is the description by a non-caver member of the sheriff's group of a sharp ridge of rock at a bend in the passage that caused a lot of difficulty getting the victim pulled across. However, the sheriff's department spokesman said earlier that if there were speleothems they would not be spared if this action meant saving the man's life or cause injury to the rescuers.
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Re: Another rescue in progress at Utah's Nutty Putty Cave

Postby Leitmotiv » Nov 26, 2009 11:26 pm

Ah I got it. Yeah the formations, while pretty, would definitely be a distant thought when trying to save someone's life. It appears they tried everything they could, but it's hard when you're working against the clock.
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Re: Another rescue in progress at Utah's Nutty Putty Cave

Postby ArCaver » Nov 27, 2009 12:27 am

This is a terrible thing to happen any time of the year, but especially now, at the beginning of the holidays it must be hard on Jones' family, some of whom are surely reading this thread. My condolences to all and my utmost respect to all who tried their best for a better ending to this drama. It's good to know there are people that can be counted on in an emergency.
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Re: Another rescue in progress at Utah's Nutty Putty Cave

Postby OpenTrackRacer » Nov 27, 2009 12:29 am

What a sad situation. From all the reports, it doesn't sound like he had a safely line attached or a backup plan. Very unfortunate and something for all of us to keep in mind. We're headed out to the Owens Valley for a three day mine exploring trip tomorrow and our whole group has been following the story and taking about this all day. It sounds like there was some incredible work by the rescuers and everyone involved is to be commended for their dedication and effort.

I can't stand this sort of knee-jerk reaction to incidents like this. It happens when people are hurt or injured in mines as well. You don't see people calling for Yosemite or Joshua Tree to be closed every time a climber is hurt or killed. I can't remember a trip to Yosemite without seeing the high altitude rescue helicopter a few times and at least one rescue on El Capitan.

Mike

Caverdale wrote:One report quotes the Utah County Sheriff as saying that the cave will be or should be permanently closed, a stance that he took several years ago. His problem is mainly with the cost of rescue. While there were many volunteers, most of the 100+ people at the site were paid employees. In addition, there were probably a couple dozen vehicles from various organizations involved including the huge rescue trucks from the fire departments and at least one helicopter.
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Re: Another rescue in progress at Utah's Nutty Putty Cave

Postby cavefox » Nov 27, 2009 10:36 am

The Salt Lake Tribune posted this today on the web:
http://www.sltrib.com/News/ci_13873501

"The equipment used in the attempted rescue did not fail, Cannon said. It was a failure of the rock where the apparatus was anchored, he said. The rope system rescuers used was highly reliable and included redundant parts for extra safety, he said.
"Getting wedged in there, it's difficult to grasp how [hard] it is to get around the different formations down there," he said.
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Re: Another rescue in progress at Utah's Nutty Putty Cave

Postby gfg3w » Nov 27, 2009 12:34 pm

I'm a friend of John's. I just wanted to say thanks to the rescue workers and cavers who worked so tirelessly to try to get him out. He was a good man with a promising future, and my thoughts go out to his wife and daughter.
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Re: Another rescue in progress at Utah's Nutty Putty Cave

Postby pub » Nov 27, 2009 3:29 pm

Welcome to the forum gfg3w! Thank you for sharing your feelings with us.

John’s accident has gained worldwide attention esp. with the caving community and I’m sure they feel for those who knew him. Please accept our condolences and heart-felt sorrow and convey the same to John’s family and friends.

Sincerely,
jerry
Balincaguin comes from the Zambal phrase, "Bali lan caguing" meaning "house of bats."
This was the former name of the Municipality of Mabini, Pangasinan, when it was part of the Province of Zambales (of Mt. Pinatubo Volcano fame).
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Re: Another rescue in progress at Utah's Nutty Putty Cave

Postby pub » Nov 27, 2009 3:39 pm

chezdebs wrote:On behalf of New Zealand Cavers, I'd like to extend our heart felt sympathy for the lose of John Jones. We know everyone will be feeling very upset. It's a tough job and you all must be absolutely gutted!. Please pass on our thoughts to everyone. Kind regards Debbie Cade New Zealand Speleological Society.
Welcome to the forum Debbie! Thanks for your kind thoughts. At least we know it reached one of John's friends.

Please invite more of the NZ cavers to join us here!

Browse slowly and post on!
Balincaguin comes from the Zambal phrase, "Bali lan caguing" meaning "house of bats."
This was the former name of the Municipality of Mabini, Pangasinan, when it was part of the Province of Zambales (of Mt. Pinatubo Volcano fame).
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Re: Another rescue in progress at Utah's Nutty Putty Cave

Postby pub » Nov 27, 2009 4:10 pm

Posted in mormontimes.com:
Emiley Morgan wrote:...He (John's father) was quiet and somber as the family's LDS bishop read a prepared statement, but broke his silence long enough to thank the 100-plus volunteers who worked for hours to free his son. He thanked everyone who followed the story for their interest and support. For their thoughts and their prayers...

"We'll never fully understand how or why it was John's time to leave us. But we find comfort knowing that he fulfilled his purpose here on Earth, and that we will be reunited with him again," the family stated, adding thanks to the many people and agencies that helped them and John. "Thank you, and God bless all of you on this Thanksgiving Day."
Balincaguin comes from the Zambal phrase, "Bali lan caguing" meaning "house of bats."
This was the former name of the Municipality of Mabini, Pangasinan, when it was part of the Province of Zambales (of Mt. Pinatubo Volcano fame).
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Re: Another rescue in progress at Utah's Nutty Putty Cave

Postby brngk » Nov 27, 2009 5:18 pm

Many condolences from AZ, my heart goes out to all his family and friends.
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Re: Another rescue in progress at Utah's Nutty Putty Cave

Postby Caverdale » Nov 27, 2009 6:05 pm

The powers in charge just announced that all efforts to remove the body from Nutty Putty Cave have been suspended and that the cave will be sealed from all access. Details are sketchy, but I personally can't believe that they are going to permanently leave him down there. I recommended in two interviews today with KSL-TV5 and the Salt Lake Tribune that only the area that causes all the rescues needs to be sealed and the rest left open. If the cave is made John Jones's grave, like it now sounds, I think that would be totally irresponsible, IMHO. Stay tuned for further information. Read the latest at:
http://www.ksl.com/?nid=148&sid=8820090
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