Scott McCrea wrote:Welcome to CaveChat, monkey!
You need to gather some more.
A LOT more.
Moderator: Tim White
Scott McCrea wrote:Welcome to CaveChat, monkey!
You need to gather some more.
...the rock holding the haul system crumbled and the entire system came out of the wall and hit Ryan Shurtz (one of the rescuers) in the face.
jaa45993 wrote:Hi everyone. Bonny and I spent all day yesterday at this rescue now turned recovery. As you can tell from the news, it was a frustrating, emotionally taxing ordeal for all involved.
I am not an official spokesperson for the rescue, nor a member of the command team, so my comments should be taken just as the impressions of one of the team members.
I was in the cave for about 12 hours yesterday as part of the effort. There were many ups and downs, a lot of heroic effort, and much determination. I would like to commend the sherriffs, fire teams, and county SAR for working so well with the cavers that were there. Cavers were recognized as vital, integral members of the team. Only small cavers could actually get near John. He got himself into a truly horrible situation, and not even everyone's best effort was enough to free him.
The press coverage has been very accurate, especially considering that they could not see really any of what was going on. I would like to clear up one thing however. Several news outlets have reported that John was "free" and then the rigging failed, sending him back to where he started. This is incorrect. When the redirect popped, John was still several hours from being "free". I estimate he was probably 2 hours of hauling and squeezing from where he would have been able to sit up. The haul systems ran through a twisting passage, requiring pulleyed redirects at each corner, four in all. As far as I can tell, the last one was set up on a natural anchor. It was very near the patient, one bend beyond where I could fit. I believe it was the anchor itself that blew, not the rope or cord as reported. The rescuer was actually hit in the face with two rescue pulleys and two carabiners.
While this setback was definitely the turning point of the rescue, John probably lost about two feet of progress as a result. Rescuers had already moved him a ways up the passage in the 15 or so hours before this. He was still a long way from being free, even without the blowout. Once the rigging was rebuilt with better anchors, by this time John was too exhausted to help us, rendering the setup useless. We were hauling him into a tight spot, with only his feet visible. He was head-down for 24 hours, with no way to turn him, and the clock beat us.
Sympathy and prayers go out to his family.
NZcaver wrote:Perhaps you'd like to read some of the early replies in this topic, before leaping to the wrong conclusions.
I'll help you out.
monkey wrote:From what I gather, the death was caused by the BOLT failure.
1.Why did the bolt fail?
2. Why were there not 2 bomber bolts at every directional?
3. Why were 2 pulleys attached to one friggin bolt hanger?
4. How long and what type was the bolt that failed?
5. Why the hell cant you get a dead guy out of the cave? Use a winch at that point!
The kid was out until that bolt failed.
Hence the concrete cap!
monkey wrote:You should never leave a man behind.
monkey wrote: Would you like to be left in a damp dark cave forever.
monkey wrote:Im not trying to point fingers here, or offend anybody.
The guy has 2 kids and his body should be recovered at any cost.
Would you like to be left in a damp dark cave forever.
If I could get permission, I would do it by myself.
You cant change the fact that sombody died from their own actions, But when you can safely reach the body then why would you cover the whole damn thing in concrete?
This needs to be fixed!!!
monkey wrote:Im not trying to point fingers here, or offend anybody.
The guy has 2 kids and his body should be recovered at any cost.
Would you like to be left in a damp dark cave forever.
If I could get permission, I would do it by myself.
You cant change the fact that sombody died from their own actions, But when you can safely reach the body then why would you cover the whole damn thing in concrete?
This needs to be fixed!!!
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