Cave Rescue & World Cup

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Cave Rescue & World Cup

Postby ohiocaver » Jul 8, 2014 2:30 pm

Did anyone else cringe during the Brazil-Colombia match the other day when Brazil's Neymar went down with a back injury (he said he couldn't feel his legs) and the 1st Aid team simply loaded him (albeit gently) into a sked and took him off the field? I saw was no neck brace, no backboard. Or is there some stabilizing lining in those litters that I'm not aware of? Turns out he has a broken vertebra.
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Re: Cave Rescue & World Cup

Postby bradyfl » Jul 8, 2014 3:54 pm

A sked is typically used with a backboard. I didnt see it so I dont know
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Re: Cave Rescue & World Cup

Postby Anonymous_Coward » Jul 8, 2014 4:19 pm

I did not see this match, but in a different one I saw four "rescuers" load a patient into a Ferno litter, pick it up and then RUN off the field with it. It goes against everything we teach about rescuer safety. I realize that it is a flat soccer field, but the very real possibility exists for one of the running rescuers to trip, and cause injury to all involved. It is only half a soccer field width. For God's sake, WALK!
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Re: Cave Rescue & World Cup

Postby Scott McCrea » Jul 8, 2014 4:46 pm

Nate Skelton was telling us in CO that there is a movement to lessen the use of back boards and neck braces. This is second hand info, but what I got from it was, being gentle can actually be safer than trying to wrangle braces and boards into place.
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Re: Cave Rescue & World Cup

Postby muddymike » Jul 8, 2014 11:15 pm

Scott McCrea wrote:Nate Skelton was telling us in CO that there is a movement to lessen the use of back boards and neck braces. This is second hand info, but what I got from it was, being gentle can actually be safer than trying to wrangle braces and boards into place.


I have been hearing the same in EMS trauma symposiums and papers. This very well may be in the future of trauma care. It has been floating around in KY for a while but in EMS while moving the patient we still immobilize. As of recent (5+ years) we do sometimes rule out c-spine injury and only use spine board or split/scoop board for movement to a stretcher. All areas are diffrent some EMS services fully immobilize for an isolated broken leg.
One ER we frequent starts removing all equipment as soon as the injured hits the trauma room, unless a known spinal injury has occurred. I have heard of patients being on immobilized for hours in emergency rooms before they are cleared of injury causing pressure related injuries to tissue.
Nothing is standard for long it seems, I guess that's why it's "practicing medicine" :wink:
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Re: Cave Rescue & World Cup

Postby Stridergdm » Jul 9, 2014 9:54 pm

muddymike wrote:
Scott McCrea wrote:Nate Skelton was telling us in CO that there is a movement to lessen the use of back boards and neck braces. This is second hand info, but what I got from it was, being gentle can actually be safer than trying to wrangle braces and boards into place.


I have been hearing the same in EMS trauma symposiums and papers. This very well may be in the future of trauma care. It has been floating around in KY for a while but in EMS while moving the patient we still immobilize. As of recent (5+ years) we do sometimes rule out c-spine injury and only use spine board or split/scoop board for movement to a stretcher. All areas are diffrent some EMS services fully immobilize for an isolated broken leg.
One ER we frequent starts removing all equipment as soon as the injured hits the trauma room, unless a known spinal injury has occurred. I have heard of patients being on immobilized for hours in emergency rooms before they are cleared of injury causing pressure related injuries to tissue.
Nothing is standard for long it seems, I guess that's why it's "practicing medicine" :wink:


If I can find the article I had on this I'll repost, but yes, there's a slow change in immobilization protocols. Basically they aren't necessary in most cases it appears, and often do more harm than good.
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Re: Cave Rescue & World Cup

Postby muddymike » Jul 9, 2014 10:20 pm

This is an EMS world article from 2012 - Why We Need to Rethink C-Spine Immobilization

http://www.emsworld.com/article/1081373 ... bilization
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Re: Cave Rescue & World Cup

Postby Stridergdm » Jul 11, 2014 6:14 am

muddymike wrote:This is an EMS world article from 2012 - Why We Need to Rethink C-Spine Immobilization

http://www.emsworld.com/article/1081373 ... bilization


Thanks, I believe that was the article I had in mind.
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Re: Cave Rescue & World Cup

Postby ohiocaver » Jul 23, 2014 9:45 pm

Having talked to a couple of NCRC folk at NSS Convention last week, it appears that there may be change afoot in the number of cases where immobilization is recommended...at least in the literature. But I have to agree: I'd have walked him off the field at the very least.
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