lenslover2003 wrote:-I think most people have a good idea of basic first aid for caving.
It might seem cold and heartless,but I think there is little middle ground on treating injuries in a cave. The injured person either makes his way out - hopefully with basic intervention and pain meds - or it becomes a body recovery.
To me ,the best first aid kit is a simple one- a few decent bandages,basic OTC meds,and then a few big guns to just get you out of there! Like, some Percodan,and a stimulant of some kind,if needed.
Realistically,if someone suffers a severe injury, there isn't a trauma surgeon in the world that is going to be able to help you,in the bottom of some pit or tight crawlway.
I have to take exception with a couple of points here.
1st, I suspect the avg caver has no idea of how to deal with shock, which if you are on a team where a member suffers a serious injury, is the first danger point.
2nd, as one who has been involved in 2 full blown rescues, several "self-rescue" situations and have first hand knowledge of several others... it all depends. I know one guy who broke his back, lived and still walks. Another guy had his hand crushed when a large piece of breakdown fell on it. I know another guy who dislocated his shoulder way back in a cave where the situation was deal with it, right then and there... or... let us just say, rescue was not an option, impossible even.
On the flip side, I know 2 cavers who didn't make it, one who died in mid rescue, the other never had a chance. In one of the F-B rescues I was involved with, 5 of 6 people were dead before we even got to the cave.
3rd: I agree that the simple F-Aid pack is best... but if I get hurt underground, and I am not 100% with it, and you give me some Percodans... You have just killed me. I am allergic to aspirin. So if you give somebody something, they better be totally coherent, and you better have a working knowledge of pharmacology.
4th: Yeah, there isn't a trauma surgeon who can help you at the bottom of a pit... But your buddies who are there can... If they know how.
One last personal experience: 4 wks ago my son broke his arm (complete displacement of the Ulna) at the Spring AACS project... fortunately it was above ground, but if it had been underground the result would have been the same: complete recovery. While he was getting "shockie" there were several trained people there capable of dealing with the situation (I was 40 miles back to Misery when it happened) and I actually had to talk myself into turning around and going back to Mountain View. I knew he was getting the best care possible, and I would only be "moral support".
So here's to Emily Frank, Jim Terry, "Big" Ed Corfey and all the rest of the MOLES... I love you guys.
tom
ps: Tim, you might be off topic, but... the patient is stabilized... Now what? go to one of the NCRC seminars, because as Rick Haley told me, it will make you a better caver.