Fixed rope climbing: Brand new, tips needed!

[Connahhh]

Yesterday, I needed some knot help from my Dad. He knows a ton of knots, but I really never got into it. I needed to learn how to tie a bolin (Sp?). After three hours, I knew a few - The Prussic knot being the one to spark my interest.

I learned the prussic and thought that fixed rope climbing would be a ton of fun. I did a little internet research and found a much easier way with karabiners. I bought two cheap karabiners and two 10 feet peices of 5mm rope to make the foot things. Luckily, I had two 40 foot 10mm rope in my garage.

So anyway, I went out with a friend today to try to figure it out. We threw the rope up on a sturdy tree branch about 10 feet up. No real need to belay. We got all of the knots and stuff and tried it - Man is that hard! After an hour or so we got the jist of it. Descending is the hard part with our set-up! After that, we moved to about a 15 foot branch and set up the belaying rope. We set it all up and did most of it, man is that tiring!

So anyway, I signed up for the forums to find out any and all information you guys can give me regarding it. Would it be a good idea to get ascenders? Is there a much more fun way of doing this? How can you minimise the amount of effort? Basically, just give me all the info you can.

Thanks so much in advance. Even redirecting me to a site or thread would be fantastic. Google didn't give me much results, mainly because I didn't really know what I was searchng for.

[Scott McCrea]

The easiest, funnest way to learn is to be taught by folks that already know how to do it. If you have a grotto (caving club) nearby, they will be happy to help. Where are you? We can point you towards a grotto.

Otherwise, there are numerous threads in the On Rope category where you can learn all sorts of things.

[Ralph E. Powers]

The easiest, funnest way to learn is to be taught by folks that already know how to do it. If you have a grotto (caving club) nearby, they will be happy to help. Where are you? We can point you towards a grotto.

Otherwise, there are numerous threads in the On Rope category where you can learn all sorts of things.

What Scott said.
One of the biggest things that cavers worry about concerning techniques on the internet is people going out and trying them without a learned/experienced instructor showing them the hows and whys and wherefor's of climbing (static) ropes. We have tried and true techniques that when done and taught properly lead to wonderful adventures and when they're not, they lead to hospitalization and/or death.

We're more than happy to show you how to do it right than to rescue you. Or at least... read about your rescue.

[Dwight Livingston]

Same - what Scott said. Do it with some folks who know how. But also read up and learn what you can on your own. It'll make it easier to learn when you do practice with an experienced person. Look at the chapters at http://caves.com/vertical. That'll give you at lot to chew on.

Dwight

[adleedy]

But also read up and learn what you can on your own. It'll make it easier to learn when you do practice with an experienced person
Dwight

ill agree with this, reading and learning on your own can have great result, granted you research it enough and you are 100% positive that it is the right way....practice doesnt make perfect, perfect practice makes perfect.

[Stridergdm]

I'll also agree with the others, find a grotto or some local folks who know this.

Based on your post, I think you're taking some risks you may not be aware of.

For example while a belay sounds good, if you're not clear on your knots (bowline btw), you may not be doing a safe or proper belay. And in any event, the belay won't help you if you get stuck on the rope. It won't help you down. And it can introduce dangers. Remember, you're at the mercy of Newton. Say you start to spin and tangle the belay and main rope when you're 10' off the ground. Now you can't go up or down. What will you do then?

With proper training you can how to rig this in a more safe manner.

As for other systems, hell yeah. Ask 5 different cavers what the best system is and you'll get at least 6 answers.

Also get a copy of "On Rope", well worth the read.

But most definitely find some local folks who know what they're doing. As others have said, we'd much rather teach you then rescue you. (Though we will rescue you if need be.)

Where in the country are you?

[Connahhh]

I'll also agree with the others, find a grotto or some local folks who know this.

Based on your post, I think you're taking some risks you may not be aware of.

For example while a belay sounds good, if you're not clear on your knots (bowline btw), you may not be doing a safe or proper belay. And in any event, the belay won't help you if you get stuck on the rope. It won't help you down. And it can introduce dangers. Remember, you're at the mercy of Newton. Say you start to spin and tangle the belay and main rope when you're 10' off the ground. Now you can't go up or down. What will you do then?

With proper training you can how to rig this in a more safe manner.

As for other systems, hell yeah. Ask 5 different cavers what the best system is and you'll get at least 6 answers.

Also get a copy of "On Rope", well worth the read.

But most definitely find some local folks who know what they're doing. As others have said, we'd much rather teach you then rescue you. (Though we will rescue you if need be.)

Where in the country are you?

I am always doing this with a friend, so I am hoping they will help me out of a situation thats over my head. But I will definetly seek out instruction.

I am looking for a copy of On Rope. Amazon only has a hardcover, but I will get that if its the only I can find.

Anywhere in New Hampshire will be acceptable travel.

[ljthawk]

Look into getting "Alpine Caving Techniques", IMO sells both. As far as I know, "On Rope" is only available in hard cover. If I could only buy one, I would probably buy "Alpine Caving Techniques".

Another option is "Vertical" which is available through links at http://www.caves.com.

L.J.

[hank moon]

If I could only buy one, I would probably buy "Alpine Caving Techniques".

true that.


double true to what others have said regarding training and instruction. be careful if you go the grotto route. instructors will be well-intentioned (of course!) but vary in quality. Shopping around will be rewarded. Lest anyone take that as a slight against themselves, a friend, the grotto system, etc.

It's not

Just a recognition that private instructors are often better at teaching skills than the highly-motivated-but-probably-less-skilled grotto instructor.


Bruce Smith offers extensive vertical training through his OnRope1 business. An alternative: SPRAT certification for rope access technicians. You won't get the caving focus, but you will begin to acquire a heap of valuable vertical skills.

[Stridergdm]

I am always doing this with a friend, so I am hoping they will help me out of a situation thats over my head. But I will definetly seek out instruction.

I am looking for a copy of On Rope. Amazon only has a hardcover, but I will get that if its the only I can find.

Anywhere in New Hampshire will be acceptable travel.

Please do. There's something called Hanging Harness Syndrome that can be very dangerous (to the point of fatal). Now, it's VERY unlikely you'll encounter this outside hanging from a tree, but it's entirely possible.

As for New Hampshire, probably the Boston Grotto is the closest, but I'm not sure.

Sometime this fall when I'm back in upstate NY (I'm in DC now) stop on by and we can do some caving.

[Connahhh]

I am always doing this with a friend, so I am hoping they will help me out of a situation thats over my head. But I will definetly seek out instruction.

I am looking for a copy of On Rope. Amazon only has a hardcover, but I will get that if its the only I can find.

Anywhere in New Hampshire will be acceptable travel.

Please do. There's something called Hanging Harness Syndrome that can be very dangerous (to the point of fatal). Now, it's VERY unlikely you'll encounter this outside hanging from a tree, but it's entirely possible.

As for New Hampshire, probably the Boston Grotto is the closest, but I'm not sure.

Sometime this fall when I'm back in upstate NY (I'm in DC now) stop on by and we can do some caving.

Ill look into the Boston Grotto. Thanks.

[NZcaver]

There's something called Hanging Harness Syndrome that can be very dangerous (to the point of fatal).

Is that something like Harness Hang Syndrome? Seriously though, good point.

New Hampshire actually does have a grotto, info here [Edit - sorry, it's now defunct I'm told]

Or there's the neighboring Vermont Cavers Association, and of course Boston Grotto. Connecticut and upstate NY also have active grottos, and a locator can be found on the NSS website here.

Depending on what your specific need/interest is, you may even want to consider professional instruction like Hank mentioned. There are a number of companies and individuals in the northeast who offer professional courses in rope access and rope rescue. And if your interest is primarily in trees, there are arborists who do that stuff for a living. Some use the more traditional treeclimbing (with rope) techniques, while others utilize single rope techniques (SRT) like us cavers here.

The books On Rope and Alpine Caving Techniques are great references, but if you want to take a look at a similar publication online in PDF format (for free!), try http://cavediggers.com/vertical/