Which descender do you use?

[jmo]

Yep, I figured that you probably do some climbing as well. Do you use STATIC rope for caving? How smooth does it feed through the TRE, or through your ATC?

(By the way jmo, I think I like your old avatar better. No offense...)

I do use a PMI Max-Wear static line for caving. I mainly use a Petzl Reverso with a autoblock knot or a shunt for backup on it and it works like a charm.

[chh]

jmo,
Do you mean you use the reverso with the autoblock for caving? You must be in some pretty benign caves. I haven't used a reverso caving, but did trash an ATC after 2 relatively short drops in a sandy/muddy cave. (Each was less than 100 feet)It got SHARP. I don't own a reverso, but have seen one that had been heavily used get sharp on the edge too, especially because Petzl uses that flat stock metal. Keep an eye on that Reverso, especially if you using it heavily in caves and then taking it to the crags as well. I just got the new BD ATC-XP Guide, and it will see it's first multi-pitch this weekend. I'm pretty excited to see how it will do! Oh, also, I've never seen one of those TRE's in person. If you have to escape the belay, do you lock it off in the same manner you would a tube style device?

For the record lately I've been using a Petzl Stop for all my caving, but don't own it. It's on extended loan thanks to a gracious friend. Before that I used a standard SMC 6-bar for everthing with the occasional 8 or Münter for really short stuff. But my rack hasn't seen any use in the last year other than bouncing a 180 meter pit twice. (Single pitch, no rebelays) I like the Stop because you can still crawl around in a passage with it on your harness a heck of a lot easier than with a rack and it doesn't smack your kneecaps when you get off rope!:)

Happy Caving!

-caleb

[Scott McCrea]

I did this same poll on the previous version of this Discussion Board. Unfortunately, the poll is lost. Google did not cache it for some reason. From what I remember, the results were very similar to what we are seeing now.

I also did the poll on the Caves.com Vertical Caving Yahoo group. The results were also similar to what we are finding here:

6 bar rack --------23
Mini rack ----------13
Figure 8 ------------2
Bobbin or Stop ----3
other ---------------0

BTW, I use a Micro Rack most (50% of the time). Followed closely by a 6 bar rack (30%) and a Fig 8 (20%)

[tangled_slinky]

I just got the new BD ATC-XP Guide, and it will see it's first multi-pitch this weekend. I'm pretty excited to see how it will do!

...while surveying at carter. yes. of course.

[chh]

...while surveying at carter. yes. of course. Very Happy

No survey for me this weekend, missy. I'm going to play on the rocks that stick OUT of the ground.......

Have fun with Grandpa and ham sammies!!!

[Ralph E. Powers]

My primary descender is a six bar stainless SMC rack. But I do use an 8 and a bobbin ... depending upon where I go.

[jmo]

jmo,
Do you mean you use the reverso with the autoblock for caving? You must be in some pretty benign caves. I haven't used a reverso caving, but did trash an ATC after 2 relatively short drops in a sandy/muddy cave. (Each was less than 100 feet)It got SHARP. I don't own a reverso, but have seen one that had been heavily used get sharp on the edge too, especially because Petzl uses that flat stock metal. Keep an eye on that Reverso, especially if you using it heavily in caves and then taking it to the crags as well. I just got the new BD ATC-XP Guide, and it will see it's first multi-pitch this weekend. I'm pretty excited to see how it will do! Oh, also, I've never seen one of those TRE's in person. If you have to escape the belay, do you lock it off in the same manner you would a tube style device?

For the record lately I've been using a Petzl Stop for all my caving, but don't own it. It's on extended loan thanks to a gracious friend. Before that I used a standard SMC 6-bar for everthing with the occasional 8 or Münter for really short stuff. But my rack hasn't seen any use in the last year other than bouncing a 180 meter pit twice. (Single pitch, no rebelays) I like the Stop because you can still crawl around in a passage with it on your harness a heck of a lot easier than with a rack and it doesn't smack your kneecaps when you get off rope!:)

Happy Caving!

-caleb

The Reverso has held up quite well. It has a few scratches and dings but it still does the job nicely. Although I haven't dropped anything longer than 70' with it.

You'll have to let me know how the Black Diamond ATC works on your adventure. BD makes some awesome stuff.

I do a tie-off just like a standard ATC. Good times. I know I should be using a rack, I'm just so used to using a ATC for rappelling I find it very familiar.

[NZcaver]

I did this same poll on the previous version of this Discussion Board. Unfortunately, the poll is lost. Google did not cache it for some reason. From what I remember, the results were very similar to what we are seeing now.

I also did the poll on the Caves.com Vertical Caving Yahoo group. The results were also similar to what we are finding here...

Sorry, Scott. I didn't realize I was treading on your territory by posting this poll.

I just seemed like the logical thing to do after starting the recent carabiner/maillon poll. Glad to hear the results are looking reasonably consistent with your previous polls...

[Scott McCrea]

No territorial problem with me. I'm glad you did it. I had been meaning to continue the poll since this version of the DB started. Never got around to it. Then, I forgot about it. So, thanks for pulling back up.

[Scott McCrea]

I did this same poll on the previous version of this Discussion Board. Unfortunately, the poll is lost. Google did not cache it for some reason. From what I remember, the results were very similar to what we are seeing now.

Scratch that. I found the old DB's poll cached in Google. The results were:

6 bar rack----------17
Micro rack-----------9
Figure 8--------------5
Bobbin or Stop------6
Other-----------------1
Total Voters--------38

[Adam Byrd]

I like the Rack D11

Really? Have you used any other racks?

The 1st rack I owned was a Petzl and I never liked it very much. It seemed difficult to change bar spacing, and dropping/adding a bar was a real pain, since the Petzl bars have an angled slot which necessitated squeezing the heck out of the legs.

I thought that the 'idiot bar' in the 2nd position was a neat feature, though.

[speloman]

[quote="Adam Byrd"][quote="speloman"] I like the Rack D11 [/quote]

Really? Have you used any other racks?

The 1st rack I owned was a Petzl and I never liked it very much. It seemed difficult to change bar spacing, and dropping/adding a bar was a real pain, since the Petzl bars have an angled slot which necessitated squeezing the heck out of the legs.

I thought that the 'idiot bar' in the 2nd position was a neat feature, though.[/quote]

Yes I have tried other racks. The only reason I got this one at the time was because the store I went to only had this one and I wanted it right away. I was verry impatient and I had money whata combo. I have noticed yes it is hard to change the spacing etc. especially with larger diameter ropes. I use 11 mm static ropes and it is a pretty slow decent. But smooth I still like it but want to move to greener pastures.

[Caver]

I prefer the rack. My first rack was homemade back in the 70's and has a curled attachment point. I also have a standard 6- bar rack, a 5- bar rack with a twisted eye, and a 6- bar rack with a twisted eye (the one I use all the time). I also usually carry a figure 8 in my pack. I have used a Bonati (Kong) Robot too, but I did not like it that much.

[NZcaver]

Come on! 758 registered cavers on this forum, and only 46 of you do any vertical caving? I don't think so!

BUMP!

[Nuke]

Most stuff, I use a CMI 4-aluminum bar Mini-Rack without a hyper (not many big drops here); when I need more control or am doing a long drop, I use a full size CMI stainless 6-bar rack with hyperbar. I am currently making up a set of stainless pipe bars for the mini (two swinging bars and twin fixed hyperbars).

I realise that different bars have different characteristics (aluminum = more friction and skid marks; stainless = slipperier and longer life), but here's my question: what goes into the choice between solid bars, hollow bars and sheet metal bars? At what point does increased surface area become less important than mass needed as a heat sink? On a REALLLLY long drop will the stamped sheet metal bars on my big rack heat up too much and melt the rope, or will the increased surface area keep them adequately cool? Discuss...

Nuke