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I've swapped the footlopp/top ascender in my frog system from a Petzl handled ascencion to a basic to reduce weight. I was using a maillon to connect my GGG webbing footloop to my handled ascender but this small maillon does not fit the small hole on my basic. Can someone recommend a maillon size that would fit the small "etrier" hole (according to Petzl" spec sheet" i can't figure what size this hole is and what size and shape of maillon would fit it and properly hold my foot loop?

You could always drill it out a little bigger. I think that's what I did on my handled ascender.

Not real sure if i understand what you mean. But i use a 7mm oval on mine

drown wrote:I've swapped the footlopp/top ascender in my frog system from a Petzl handled ascencion to a basic to reduce weight. I was using a maillon to connect my GGG webbing footloop to my handled ascender but this small maillon does not fit the small hole on my basic. Can someone recommend a maillon size that would fit the small "etrier" hole (according to Petzl" spec sheet" i can't figure what size this hole is and what size and shape of maillon would fit it and properly hold my foot loop?

Welcome to the forum.

As I recall the current model Basic has about a 6mm diameter secondary hole, which frankly isn't useful for much unless you ever need to tie a cord through it. You said you use a webbing footloop, so I suggest you pick up about a 5mm stainless delta (triangular) Maillon Rapide. You'll find a list of sizes and dimensions here.

The 5mm delta MR has a 7mm outside thread diameter, so it will not fit through the little hole in the Basic. However if you attach it through the main attachment hole, you can simply clip your cowstail carabiner into it. I do essentially the same thing, but with a 5mm stainless short oval MR and Spectra cord footloops. The system shown here illustrates the same type of connection using a handled upper ascender.

Thanks for the welcome and the quick response all.

Ok i see what hole you are talking about now, guess ive always overlooked this hole.

Not sure what the intended purpose of that small hole is, but probably not for attaching a maillon. As NZ said, perhaps a small cord, but for what purpose is unclear. Trying to use a maillon in that small hole might result in binding and crossloading on the maillon, which could cause it to fail or put some stress on the Basic. I also wouldn't try boring it out for fear that it could weaken the primary attachment.

cavemud2 wrote:Ok i see what hole you are talking about now, guess ive always overlooked this hole.

If you rig it as shown above with your cowstail clipped to the link, then link is part of your safety system. In that case, it ought to be suitably large, probably larger than what is shown. Myself, I rig the footloop with a link smaller than shown and clip my cowstail directly to the Basic, next to the footloop link.

Dwight

Dwight Livingston wrote:If you rig it as shown above with your cowstail clipped to the link, then link is part of your safety system. In that case, it ought to be suitably large, probably larger than what is shown.

Not necessarily. In that configuration you only need your Maillon Rapide to be comparable with the weakest point in the system, i.e. the ascender itself. When connected to a rope for normal use, the anticipated nominal minimum rope damage/failure force is between 4kN and 6.5kN. This is less than the MBS of a 4mm steel oval or 3mm(!) stainless oval MR. The example shown in cavemud2's photo should do just fine in that application.

Myself, I rig the footloop with a link smaller than shown and clip my cowstail directly to the Basic, next to the footloop link.

You're not the only one to do this, but it does limit your flexibility if you want to disconnect your long cowstail while leaving the footloop and ascender connected together.

I will have to look, not sure if thats a 7mm or 9mm i cant remember but its stainless which gives more strength as well. The picture that NZcaver had linked in the previous post is what i built my frog system from. I have always used a ropewalker and have only used this a few times. Im trying to convert myself over to the frog

Here's how I do it. Honestly...I can't remember if I drilled out THIS ascender(MY old Petzl ascender) or if I drilled out the Kong.

I thought about going to the Basic, but I have too many uses for the handle. AND I like the (really) old thumb screw.





Of course...I also use the On Rope 1 footloop. I personally like the single loop version. It's the only "adjust on the fly" foot loop(s) on the market.

Since we're all sharing, here's mine.



(From this previous topic on changeovers, cowstail carabiners and maillons.)

Post deleted.

NZcaver wrote:

Dwight Livingston wrote:If you rig it as shown above with your cowstail clipped to the link, then link is part of your safety system. In that case, it ought to be suitably large, probably larger than what is shown.

Not necessarily. In that configuration you only need your Maillon Rapide to be comparable with the weakest point in the system, i.e. the ascender itself. When connected to a rope for normal use, the anticipated nominal minimum rope damage/failure force is between 4kN and 6.5kN. This is less than the MBS of a 4mm steel oval or 3mm(!) stainless oval MR. The example shown in cavemud2's photo should do just fine in that application.

Sure. That's why I didn't give sizes and said "probably". I'd add, though, the link has to stand up to much abuse in that location. I wouldn't shave it too close.

Myself, I rig the footloop with a link smaller than shown and clip my cowstail directly to the Basic, next to the footloop link.

You're not the only one to do this, but it does limit your flexibility if you want to disconnect your long cowstail while leaving the footloop and ascender connected together.

I clip the cowstail biner in next to the footloop link, so I can disconnect.

Very interesting to see all these rigs.

For what it's worth here is how Petzl describes this small hole.


With my handled ascender I could use a maillon in the small hole to permanently attach my footloop, and a biner for my cowstail in the large hole. I can no longer use this setup on the basic unless I find a maillon of a suitable size that is also strong enough. Not sure if that exists.

I guess I'm also confused about "racking" or attaching the basic and footloop to my harness if I need to use both branches of my cowstail. I guess that's were a spare biner comes in handy. But it does add to the clutter.

For those who are clipping both into the large hole, is there enough room for a maillon and biner and still remain flexible enough.