PMI Talon and Uric Acid

[Chads93GT]

PMI says the Talon rope is slightly more resistant than nylon to most acids. Found out this weekend that one of my cat's pissed all over my 400' talon and im rather pissed about that, no pun intended. I know that urine causes nylon to lose 25% of its strength............... Even on the talon this leaves a breaking strength of 4000 lbs ish............... I am wondering though, does anyone know what "slightly more resistant" means?

Is there a trail of dead bodies? I have already tandem climbed on the rope, yesterday, and I had no fear of anything breaking.......

Advice? Thoughts?

[Billy]

Sure Chad, "your cat" pee'ed on it.

See Doc, I have this "friend", see? And he has this problem, see? And he was just wondering if I'd ask for him, see?

[Stridergdm]

When rock climbing, I was never sure if it was better to piss-off your belayer or to piss-on your belayer. Though I suspect pissing on them would piss them off.

Either way, I don't think I want a person who literally holds my life in their hands pissed off.

Back to this question.

I seem to recall cat pee being worse than human pee in some ways. I'd be cautious of this rope.

[wyandottecaver]

cat urine is indeed worse. However, assuming you semi-promptly washed the rope it should be O.K. Of course if the rope was a few yrs old and seen some hard wear already....buy new. FYI, I'd recommend buying new anyway, just saw where petrochemical based products were expected to double in price in the next few yrs. In 10 yrs we might be growing hemp for commercial cordage again......

[Chads93GT]

I washed it as soon as I noticed the smell on the rope. it may be a few weeks old. guess I will use it for workout training in the basement. it sort of sucks because I think it was mostly pissed on, on 1/4 or 1/3 of one end of the rope (coiled) or parts of it, but who knows............Its been used at tag twice, maybe 40 or 50 people have been up and down it at valhalla, neversink, mystery falls, moses tomb, cagles, etc. Maybe more, but ive ran through the rope scores of times when i train for going on trips down there. ugh!

[Cody JW]

Chlorine Bleach used to keep my old classic white PMI pit rope nice and white , then used to let it dry in direct sunlight. Just kidding. After washing my rope at the laundry mat people who just got on my rope would would say " Jeff- how do you keep your rope so clean ? " I would say Bleach. It was funny to see the look on their face when they were hanging from it. Great memories.

[NSS8921]

The most common answer I got on line for adult cat urine pH is 6.0-6.5. It doesn't seem like that would be harmful to nylon or polyester. Orange juice and coca cola have a lot lower pH and both of them are sold in polyester bottles. If I had cat pee on my rope I would wash it and use it without hesitation.

[Phil Winkler]

So would I. Uric acid is a very weak acid as you show. It's the smell that hurts the most. Heck, nylon lines on boats lie out in the sun for months and still hold. UV is much more dangerous then cat pee. I wouldn't retire that rope.

[graveleye]

and have the cat spayed or neutered. That should stop their spraying and peeing in the wrong places.

[AMF]

and have the cat spayed or neutered. That should stop their spraying and peeing in the wrong places.

Alas, I know from bitter experience you are wrong. VERY wrong. VERY VERY wrong. I'll leave it at that.

[graveleye]

maybe that's because I've had them fixed very young? I dunno. Never had a problem with mine spraying in the house.

I had an old tom, not fixed, years ago and he had some fetish about spraying anything made of nylon or plastic. It was weird... raincoats, windbreaker jackets, you name it... he would spray it. With him, I remedied it by making him an outside cat.

Never had a problem with the rest of them.

[Chads93GT]

The cat was abandoned by the previouis owner of our house and it was more of less a farm cat. when we brought it to the new house when we moved we kept it locked in the basement with food, water and a litter box till it got used to being fed at the new place so when we let it outside, it wouldnt run off. Well. she never used the litter box (she's fixed too by the way) she ccrapped on the floor, crapped on my car cover on my car, grrrr, and apparently, pissed on my damn rope, lol. ITs washed, coiled and she's an outside cat now and not allowed in the house anymore.

The rope doesnt smell anymore. I washed it through 2 heavy cycles in the front loader with woolite as I always do. The rope is only a year and a half old so I definately didn't want to trash it if I didnt have to. Thanks for the input.

[Jeff Bartlett]

I know that urine causes nylon to lose 25% of its strength

Do you have a reference for this? Life on a Line, 2d ed., has a table (section 8e) relating to how various chemicals and bodily fluids affect the various materials used in manufacturing rope, cord and webbing. It specifies that urine -- presumably human urine, of course -- has "no effect" on polyamide (including Nylon 6/perlon), polyester (Talon is polyester core, nylon sheath), polypropylene, HMPE (spectra), Aramid, and Vectran.

If you're worried about it, why don't you cut a small piece off and have it drop-tested? That is, of course, assuming the cat peed on (or near) the end... I'm not sure if PMI provides this service or not*, but that's what I would do if I wanted some peace of mind. 400ft is kind of an odd length anyway, so you ought to be able to spare a chunk of it.

-Jeff

*I'm also not sure if PMI wants people sending them random, urine-soaked items in the mail. Uh, call 'em first.

[Chads93GT]

I know that urine causes nylon to lose 25% of its strength

Do you have a reference for this? Life on a Line, 2d ed., has a table (section 8e) relating to how various chemicals and bodily fluids affect the various materials used in manufacturing rope, cord and webbing. It specifies that urine -- presumably human urine, of course -- has "no effect" on polyamide (including Nylon 6/perlon), polyester (Talon is polyester core, nylon sheath), polypropylene, HMPE (spectra), Aramid, and Vectran.

If you're worried about it, why don't you cut a small piece off and have it drop-tested? That is, of course, assuming the cat peed on (or near) the end... I'm not sure if PMI provides this service or not*, but that's what I would do if I wanted some peace of mind. 400ft is kind of an odd length anyway, so you ought to be able to spare a chunk of it.

-Jeff

*I'm also not sure if PMI wants people sending them random, urine-soaked items in the mail. Uh, call 'em first.

Jeff thanks for the advice. It's one of those things I've been told since I got into this that uric acid is very damaging so I guess I believe it without doing research. 400' is an odd length but.............I like it for cardio training.