Online names

[Hatch]

To paraphrase Radar O'Reilly from MASH, "Hatch is my God-given nickname."

My grandfather, father, uncles, brother, nephews, and now my new son are all called Hatch. Stephen Seagal played a character in a movie years ago with the last name Hatcher and he was called Hatch in the movie. I've had other short lived nicknames over the years, but it always comes back to Hatch.

[Scoon1]

Well the Scoon comes from my last name and the "1" comes from me being the oldest child and now the head of a family with three children.

[Phil Winkler]

I got into this internet stuff back in early 80s when it was Arpanet. Then I discovered Compuserve and was a frequent visitor to IBMAPPS\DATABASE where we had lively discussions (I know..whoopee!). Anyhow, no one back then used handles or nicknames; just their given names and usually, but not always, first and last.

Frankly, I've never understood why anyone would do otherwise since it implies hiding something, anonymity, etc.

Your mileage may vary, of course, since it is certainly a prevelant practice today and, with the net becoming what it has, likely a good idea. It really is a shame how the value of the net and email has been so degraded by spam, perverts, criminals, trolls, etc.

Sigh......

[graveleye]

hehe.. some of us might want to hide from our own grottos!

I remember those old compuserve days too.... a buddy of mine had it on his little computer.. probably a 286. He didnt think about the phone bill for the dialup and wound up with a real doozie of a bill - all from chatting. Things sure have changd.

[cob]

Frankly, I've never understood why anyone would do otherwise since it implies hiding something, anonymity, etc.

Must disagree Phil. In truth it implies nothing. That is your own preconcieved prejudice coming thru.

Take me for instance: If you had ever hit my "profile" you would have found my name and my NSS#. I am not hiding behind anything. But what does "Tom Panian" tell you? Not a d**n thing. COB? Well, for starters it tells you there is a story to be told. Now that you know the story, you know a hell of a lot more than "Thomas Anthony Panian", which was just a moniker my parents hung on me, because they had to name me something (As it worked out, it was rather apt).

Now, take you for instance: Phil Winkler. Doesn't tell me anything about you. So here is a question: If you were to pick an on-line name, what would it be, and what is the story behind it?

I like stories, stories are the breath of life, and I know you got some good ones.

tom

ps:Hatch, doesn't it get a little confusing at family events?
pss: Barbara, loved it! Did you name the squirrel?

[graveleye]

I dunno Cob, Phil has a point because I've seen it with my own eyes where people will say things under anonymity that they would never say if they were completely known. Its a disguise for them to obtain a rudeness license.

Not so much on this forum, although there are a couple. But I've seen other forums that are just chaotic - if they were all standing in the same room they would all be quite cordial.

But also, in defense of screen names, I think for myself, I just liked the way mine sounded - sort of a James Bond adventure sounding name that my mother would have never thought up..

"ahh Mr graveleye.... I should have expected you behind this plot!!"

alas, in real life, I am not so cool.

[cob]

with the net becoming what it has, likely a good idea. It really is a shame how the value of the net and email has been so degraded by spam, perverts, criminals, trolls, etc.

Sigh......

on another note, the internet is just a reflection of the society within which we live.

Spam? You should see my PO Box.

Perverts? A friend of mine had some guy steal her shoe in a dept. store. (I could tell of other incidents more personal, but hard to do so without it getting graphic.)

Crime? Wasn't so long ago, somebody thought about robbing me. They had 2nd thoughts real quick. It must have been the look in my eyes, because it sure couldn't have been my size (5-8, 160) or my "tuffness" (I'm a pussycat)A buddy of mine had his van stolen recently. The theives were thoughtful tho, and returned it the next morning. A week later they stole it again. This time they left it 3 blocks away. Then the cops had it towed and he had to pay $500 to get it out of impound (now there's the crime)

Trolls? Been to a bar lately?

3 yrs ago, I moved from South St. Louis to Crawford Co (country!) Guess what? It is even worse out here. Just a couple weeks ago we had 3 stabbings and a shooting in one wkend. And the meth-heads...?

Sigh....

tom

[cob]

I dunno Cob, Phil has a point because I've seen it with my own eyes where people will say things under anonymity that they would never say if they were completely known. Its a disguise for them to obtain a rudeness license.

Not so much on this forum, although there are a couple. But I've seen other forums that are just chaotic - alas, in real life, I am not so cool.

He has a point, but the brush is too broad. You are example #2. I have seen it here too (tho I have to admit, I have never been to another "chat" room in my life) (is this a "chat room"?) In so far as what people say in these places... I can only come at this subject from my own personal experience (which is limited to here)

But, listen to the radio lately? The proliferation of "shock Jocks"? They aren't funny. And they would never say the things they do on the radio (where they also have made up names)(again the internet is just a reflection of society) in a bar... least of all with me there. They are all of them, little more than bullies, and I hate bullies. (I was never very big, and grew up getting my a** kicked) so now when I see one (hear one)... I find myself involved in things I really don't care about.

I just feel that there are many reasons for posting anonomously. I know of one regular poster on this board, who, if you all had our history with them, you probably wouldn't give them the time of day... But because they post anonomously, with their well thought out and even, intelligent points of view... everybody listens, and even more important, youthink. about it.

just one mans point of view, which is respectfully in disagreement with phils.

tom

ps: to paraphrase a movie, you are at your most honest when you are least cool.

[JackW]

Since I've given notice to my employer, resulting in now having nothing to do for two weeks... while still showing up to work, here is my contribution...

JackW - It is based on my name, but Jack is the familiar appellation for John. I will answer to both but to anyone other than my parents, I'm Jack.

Online names I use or have used...
Speleo30 - should be obvious. The 30 from when I was 30. This is the name on my current email account
Batz - not used in a long time, but came about because "bats" was taken when I signed up for my first "paid" email account in 1996.

As for hiding or being anonymous, my NSS number is in the profile if members wish to look me up. In my signature is a link to a website that has my name and email listed as I'm a director with that organization.

Speaking of which... Cob: you've time to hang out drinkin' with Cory and Tony but not to come to the ISS projects? You going to change that? September's trip should be a good one...

[Phil Winkler]

Tom,

I find your comments very interesting and curiously enough I am surprised by your stance on many issues. In fact, it has always amazed my why everyone didn't see things my way! :)

Just kidding, but I do have an intense interest in what makes people tick. I think that comes from having spent 20 yrs in the Army in posts all over the world. You meet a lot of different people that way. My bio has been up for a long time: http://www.plmconsulting.com/biopcw.html and, of course, I've been in the NSS many years, too.

I really dislike arguments where people get attacked instead of ideas or behaviors. From what I have experienced nothing much gets accomplished when that happens. I am amazed at how progress is made within our own NSS. A BOG meeting can be a mind numbing experience for those of us listening to it and even when you're part of it. Yet, it is only thru this public discourse and voting that actions are fairly decided upon. Hey, that's democracy, isn't it?

But I think democracy requires ownership and commitment to ideals and processes. I do not think an anonymous speaker has as much credibility as an identifiable one.

As for handles it might be caver, sailor, geek, biker, yadda, yadda, but I would still be me and introduce myself to anyone by my name. I just think it is responsible and important to stand up for what you say.

My comments about the internet describe what it has become when in the beginning it had so much promise. The sharing of information was amazing and no one (in those days) was thinking how to profit from it.

Nowadays, even google searches are corrupted with the first hits being commercial sites put together by software designed to optimize a site's position in the list even tho it has scant or no relevance to your search term. Yep. Google is completely corrupted now.

Sigh....I do enjoy sailing and I do enjoy walking thru the mountains on my way to a cave or searching for new ones. With my wife by my side I can enjoy myself almost anywhere.

Celebrate life.

[Sean Ryan]

Let's say you've got an unusual name, and use it to post on a site like this. You relate some joke you rmember hearing at the OTR hot tub last year. All of a sudden, any employer can Google your name, and up pops dirty jokes and reports of co-ed nudity that you're waving around for the whole Internet to see. You're probably not going to get hired. Or if you're currently employed, you might not be by day's end.

I'd imagine most people who post here would have no problem sharing their identities with other posters. Cavers are friendly people after all. But this site isn't cavers-only, it's free to everyone. Cavers, spelunkers, bosses, online perverts: the whole range of humanity.

When I signed up here, I debated about creating some alias. Like you, Phil, I work in the media. It'd be somewhat disingenuous for me to post under an alias, I felt, since I'd be a journalist who'd perpetually not be going on the record. Using my real name limits what I can here, both because 1. all cavers can hunt me down at OTR and ask about something I wrote, and 2. anyone with Internet access can do the same thing. But that's the untouted price of free speech: responsibility for what you say.

[cob]

Speaking of which... Cob: you've time to hang out drinkin' with Cory and Tony but not to come to the ISS projects? You going to change that? September's trip should be a good one...

timing is everything, Jack, and yours (or maybe it is mine?) SUCKS!

I have a little survey project already scheduled for that wkend down in Shannon co, hope to put the finishing touches on a nice little virgin cave we found last winter( plus another we found whilst trying to reach it in a tropical rain storm). Originally had it scheduled for the wkend before but Dan L. whined so much about that being the MSS meeting, I put it off another week. So blame HIM!

I swear, that boy has way too much on his plate.

Maybe in Oct (tho I need to make a scout trip to Shannon Co then too)(for a planned ridge walk/survey trip on Turkey day wkend... interested???)

tom

[chh]

chh - just my initials. I wish it were something more creative, but it isn't. I think handles anymore are some attempt at creativity. Everyone WANTS to give themselves a cool nickname but you never seem to get the one you would give yourself in real life, do 'ya? Anyway, I Don't really go for the annonymity. My NSS# is on my profile too. Anybody who was of a mind could find out who I was. I joined this forum to talk to other cavers and maybe meet some other people outside of the grottos that I belong too to go caving (of all things! :) ). I figure we are an obscure enough community and close-knit enough that I wasn't going to be hastled too much. Plus, I don't write things that I wouldn't want other people to associate with me. That's the great thing about writing things down, you have the opportunity to think about your response before you stick your foot in your mouth.

[cob]

Tom,

I find your comments very interesting and curiously enough I am surprised by your stance on many issues.

Most people are bored to death by my comments Phil, and don't worry, they are ALL surprised by my stances.

Just kidding, but I do have an intense interest in what makes people tick.

the stuff of life... I like to be surprised by people. It keeps them interesting.

My bio has been up for a long time: http://www.plmconsulting.com/biopcw.html and, of course, I've been in the NSS many years, too.

I know Phil, but I want the stories....

I really dislike arguments where people get attacked instead of ideas or behaviors.

You argue my own point of view here...

Yet, it is only thru this public discourse and voting that actions are fairly decided upon. Hey, that's democracy, isn't it?

It is all sausage...

But I think democracy requires ownership and commitment to ideals and processes. I do not think an anonymous speaker has as much credibility as an identifiable one.

Yes Phil, but it is a fine line to be drawn. Everytime I post something I think might be controversial, I sign my name. But there are times when my name, my moniker, can detract from the point I am making. For instance, it was not that long ago, when an argument flared up, another person (with whom I am never in agreement with) and I were going back and forth... Nothing was going to be resolved. Neither of us were ever going to give an inch (this individual, I respect in general terms, but on any particular issue...) and then a moment came... a moment that proved my point exactly, in such a way that they could not possibly argue with...

If I had said anything... all would have taken it as just my taking a cheap shot. If nothing were said... Well, I cared about the issue. All is fair in love and war. So... I had somebody else say it. Point made. To all who think this was underhanded on my part I say this: If you care about the issue, and not the personality... What would you do? Knowing there is a personality conflict? And that the issue is more important than, "I don't like you."? I work with people I don't like everyday... So what? We still get the job done.

As for handles it might be caver, sailor, ...

That is the handle I like, Phil, tell me a sailing story, why you love it so.

I went sailing once (when I was 12, went to visit my old man's WWII copilot, and he took us out on the Finger lakes in upstate NY ) and have been wanting to go again, ever since... (I am now thinking of buying a Sunfish or other such simple vessel)

I just think it is responsible and important to stand up for what you say.

It is, but there are times....

My comments about the internet describe what it has become when in the beginning it had so much promise. The sharing of information was amazing and no one (in those days) was thinking how to profit from it.

It still has promise, but... Welcome to America. If there is a way to make a buck, somebody will.

Sigh....I do enjoy sailing and I do enjoy walking thru the mountains on my way to a cave or searching for new ones. With my wife by my side I can enjoy myself almost anywhere.

Tell me a sailing story, Phil. with or without your wife.

Celebrate life

Amen, brother, amen.

[cob]

That's the great thing about writing things down, you have the opportunity to think about your response before you stick your foot in your mouth.

Yeah, but I do it anyway!!!!!! ,:doh: Only difference is I don't mind admitting when I have been an idiot! I figure we all have been there before. As to the real life nick names... They tend to be rather accurate, whether we like them or not. I never would have picked COB, but there it was, and it fit. What was I to do?

chh is a good name, and originality is in the eye of the beholder.