Overlaying a COMPASS line plot to ArcGIS

[WVCaver2011]

Hi all,

I've been trying to overlay a line plot from COMPASS to ArcGIS. What all needs to be accomplished before I can overlay the line plot? I figure this question would be better than me asking is it because of this or because of that...I would rather just get things figured out.

Here's an overview of the main problem... Evertime I go to export the lineplot as a kml file it tells me:
No Georefrencing Data in plot file. Data may be missing from the project or the file may have been compiled with an old compiler. Check the fixed links in the Project Manager and recompile.

I already have my line plot's entrance coordinates saved to the line plot.. I also have the cave already lined up to Due North.

Can you help me out with this problem? I don't really care how accurate the map is at this point since I'm just doing this to get a feel for it for when I do it in the future...

[batrotter]

I believe you need an extension for ArcGIS called called CAVETOOLS.

See here page 21:

http://www.esri.com/library/bestpractic ... -karst.pdf

[WVCaver2011]

I believe there may be a bit of confusion about exactly what I want to do with the line plot... Here's a link to help with that...This is what I'm trying to do...I just cant get it to export as a kml file. http://www.fountainware.com/compass/

This is what I want to do with ArcGIS... of course I would be able to do the same thing with Google Earth If I can just get that kml file to export...

[driggs]

No Georefrencing Data in plot file. Data may be missing from the project or the file may have been compiled with an old compiler. Check the fixed links in the Project Manager and recompile.

I already have my line plot's entrance coordinates saved to the line plot.

You must create a Fixed Station so that Compass can georeference your project. Click 'Help' in the upper-right corner, and read the sections in the Compass manual Fixed Stations and Real-World Coordinates and Entering Fixed Stations, Plus Step-By-Step Instructions.

In short, if you don't already have a Project (.MAK), you will need to create one and add your survey (.DAT) to it. Once your Survey is a part of a Project, double-click on it (the .MAK node), and click the Links/Fixed Stations. You will enter the station name of your entrance, and its coordinates. Reference the Compass manual sections above for detailed instructions.

I cannot speak for Compass's KML export, but in general, an ESRI Shapefile is the preferred format for exporting to GIS. However, if you use a Shapefile, you must be conscious of what geographic datum your coordinate is in, as well as the other data which you are using alongside it (but that's a different, and complex subject in itself).

Edit:
* You do not need any additional tools or add-ons to either Compass or ArcGIS to do a lineplot overlay
* There is a dedicated Compass users email list, where active users and Larry Fish himself answer questions. Check the archives before asking a new question on the mailing list.

[WVCaver2011]

Dave,

Thanks for the help!! I had tried to export a shapefile as well and it told me the same thing so, I will use your advise and see if it helps!! I'll get back to you and let you know.

[WVCaver2011]

Dave,

I got it to overlay!! Thanks for the help! See you at the meeting tonight!

[WVCaver2011]

Okay,

I'm now wondering if there is a way that I can get the profile image to overlay as well so that I can see the cave in a 3D-like format so I can tell where other possible entrances may be... Is there anyone out there who has done this and could run me through the process or give me links or something to help me out?

[John Lovaas]

If you are interested in finding places in the cave survey that are close to the surface, you might try writing a SQL query with the Select by Attribute tool. I'm working in 9.1, so everything I am suggesting may be totally archaic and useless.

Each cave survey station has an elevation attribute, as does each cell of a digital elevation model. You'd export a shapefile of the cave survey stations, and set your fixed station's elevation- it might best if they are in the same units as your DEM. I'm just guessing there.

I can't help you with the specifics of the query, but I'd be looking for DEM cells, witihin some defined horizontal distance to the nearest cave survey station (some kind of buffer function?) , that have an elevation attribute that is equal to/less than "X" (how far to you want to dig?), when compared to the elevation attribute of the nearest survey station.

Good times. ;-)

[WVCaver2011]

If you are interested in finding places in the cave survey that are close to the surface, you might try writing a SQL query with the Select by Attribute tool. I'm working in 9.1, so everything I am suggesting may be totally archaic and useless.

Each cave survey station has an elevation attribute, as does each cell of a digital elevation model. You'd export a shapefile of the cave survey stations, and set your fixed station's elevation- it might best if they are in the same units as your DEM. I'm just guessing there.

I can't help you with the specifics of the query, but I'd be looking for DEM cells, witihin some defined horizontal distance to the nearest cave survey station (some kind of buffer function?) , that have an elevation attribute that is equal to/less than "X" (how far to you want to dig?), when compared to the elevation attribute of the nearest survey station.

Good times. ;-)

I really have no reason to dig but I would rather just like to know how much dirt and rock is above my head at any given point in the cave. Also I would like to know how close certain areas are to the surface just to see if there may be other entrances to the cave in that direction. I'm almost certain that there is another entrance to this cave and I would like to know where the most probable place for one would be.

I tried exporting a shape file but everytime I did so, ArcGIS told me that my coordinates were unknown. So I assume it's something to do with the coordinates...but I don't know what else I can do to make them correct...I'm not exactly sure what you mean by DEM...Could you elaborate on that please?

I'm not extremely familiar with compass... I've only used Compass for one "real" cave and that's the one im working on currently...

[John Lovaas]

You can right click on your cave shapefile in ArcCatalog and assign a coordinate system- that'll be the one your cave coordinates are in.

If you want to know the relationship between the cave and the surface, you'll need data that represents the surface. That's where the DEM comes in.

I'd suggest spending some time with the ESRI tutorials. If they didn't come with the copy you have, they are available online as well. It'd save me a whole bunch of typing too.

[WVCaver2011]

You can right click on your cave shapefile in ArcCatalog and assign a coordinate system- that'll be the one your cave coordinates are in.

If you want to know the relationship between the cave and the surface, you'll need data that represents the surface. That's where the DEM comes in.

I'd suggest spending some time with the ESRI tutorials. If they didn't come with the copy you have, they are available online as well. It'd save me a whole bunch of typing too.

This is what i'm trying to do to reduce any confusion... http://www.fountainware.com/compass/compesri.htm
I have already downloaded ArcGIS Explorer and it seems that there that the only free way to get ArcView is buy getting it in a 60 day trial... I'm definately not spending 1,500.00 dollars for the software ... I need to know other ways to convert the data to 3D format...and be able to view it in ArcGIS Explorer...Is there anyway I can do this without having to spend 1500.00 smackaroos??

[Spike]

Does Compass not export 3D shape files? I'm not familiar with ArcGIS Explorer but my understanding is that Compass should be creating the 3D shapefile that can be looked at with Arc Scene or ArcGIS Explorer. If you would like to PM me and send me a copy of your shapefile I can look at it with the ArcGIS tools I have. Also try contacting Bernie Szukalski for some caver Arc support.

[WVCaver2011]

Does Compass not export 3D shape files? I'm not familiar with ArcGIS Explorer but my understanding is that Compass should be creating the 3D shapefile that can be looked at with Arc Scene or ArcGIS Explorer. If you would like to PM me and send me a copy of your shapefile I can look at it with the ArcGIS tools I have. Also try contacting Bernie Szukalski for some caver Arc support.

Compass does export 3D shape files...and ArcGIS Explorer telling me that the shapefile has an "unknown coordinate system". I have no idea what to do from here because I've tried switching coordinate systems and that didnt help and Compass has numerous types of coordinate systems and 3 of these match that of ArcGIS Explorer...Still, it says "unknown coordinate system"... What should I do?

Spike: PM sent

[John Lovaas]

Hi all-

I just spent some time playing with the current download of ArcExplorer.

Using the current version of Compass, I can import a KML file of a cave survey into ArcExplorer. The only way I can bring a shapefile into ArcExplorer is by editing the shapefile's spatial reference in ArcCatalog- for whatever reason, the information doesn't come out of Compass for me, even though it is(according to the Compass documentation) set correctly within the .MAK file. Without the edit, I get an "unknown coordinate" error message in ArcExplorer. The same file would work in ArcMap for me. Oh well. You get a lot for free with ArcExplorer, but you don't get everything.

While the resulting 3D imagery is interesting, I don't think you are going to be able to do what you want to do- look at a nice 3D model of a cave floating under the land surface. For me, the cave shapefile(which is a 3Dprism) has a punched out appearance.

I've included an example of my lunchtime frittering here- the land surface is a combination of the ESRI base map and a 1m DEM of the area we are working in. The cave is a 3Dprism shapefile from Compass. I've put some transparency on the DEM. No matter how I modify the DEM's transparency, the cave shapefile's appearance remains consistent. It doesn't appear that ArcExplorer allows you to go "under" the basemap.

[WVCaver2011]

Hi all-

I just spent some time playing with the current download of ArcExplorer.

Using the current version of Compass, I can import a KML file of a cave survey into ArcExplorer. The only way I can bring a shapefile into ArcExplorer is by editing the shapefile's spatial reference in ArcCatalog- for whatever reason, the information doesn't come out of Compass for me, even though it is(according to the Compass documentation) set correctly within the .MAK file. Without the edit, I get an "unknown coordinate" error message in ArcExplorer. The same file would work in ArcMap for me. Oh well. You get a lot for free with ArcExplorer, but you don't get everything.

While the resulting 3D imagery is interesting, I don't think you are going to be able to do what you want to do- look at a nice 3D model of a cave floating under the land surface. For me, the cave shapefile(which is a 3Dprism) has a punched out appearance.

I've included an example of my lunchtime frittering here- the land surface is a combination of the ESRI base map and a 1m DEM of the area we are working in. The cave is a 3Dprism shapefile from Compass. I've put some transparency on the DEM. No matter how I modify the DEM's transparency, the cave shapefile's appearance remains consistent. It doesn't appear that ArcExplorer allows you to go "under" the basemap.

Man, that bites that you have to spend all that money just to get a shapefile to work properly... Thanks for sharing this information with us..I'm now convinced that I have to spend money to get the shapefiles to work...Unless someone on cavechat proves this wrong this is what i'll continue to believe...