Shetland Attack Pony-True Pulse-Suuntos-D3 shot comparisons

[Lava]

...the data crew
will become so much more efficient that they will have more than
enough time to draw cross sections at each station. This in turn
frees up the sketcher so that the labor is more balanced and the
survey moves forward at an even pace for all involved.

But...but...but... that'd be like Picasso letting a few mere mortals fill in a few spots on one of his beautiful paintings!

[Martin Sluka]

...
frees up the sketcher so that the labor is more balanced and the
survey moves forward at an even pace for all involved.

But...but...but... that'd be like Picasso letting a few mere mortals fill in a few spots on one of his beautiful paintings!

Hmmmm. The map of cave is DOCUMENTATION of cave not an artwork as I understand it. There are software tools right now which are able to manage not only survey legs and LRUD data but "unlimited" number of auxiliary points too. As the result the data themselves offer much better description of real cave and there is more real measured points the sketcher may use to draw more real map. The software could use these auxiliary points for much more realistic 3D model of cave, etc., etc.

Martin

[George Dasher]

I believe that the most the same instrument was used by the same person was four years. Including my brother-in-law, and me.

I really suspected the user was just holding or using the instrument just a tiny little bit different, and that was the problem.

The instrument could have taken a hard knock and been "changed," but Suuntos are really pretty tough with little to go wrong.

[cavescom]

I think. I'd be interested to hear which of the instruments(#1 or #2) were used to calibrate the SAP.

MarkP Comp1/Clino1

0 245 17
1 245 17
2 245 17
3 245 17
4 146 0
5 146 0
6 146 0
7 146 0
8 122 -33
9 122 -33
10 122 -33
11 122 -33
12 93 5
13 93 5
14 93 5
15 93 5
16 82 8
17 82 8
18 82 8
19 82 8
20 57 12
21 57 12
22 57 12
23 57 12
24 52 -29
25 52 -29
26 52 -29
27 52 -29
28 33 22
29 33 22
30 33 22
31 33 22
32 344 7
33 344 7
34 344 7
35 344 7
36 305 1
37 305 1
38 305 1
39 305 1
40 299 -15
41 299 -15
42 299 -15
43 299 -15
44 255 3
45 255 3
46 255 3
47 255 3

[cavescom]

There are software tools right now which are able to manage not only survey legs and LRUD data but "unlimited" number of auxiliary points too. As the result the data themselves offer much better description of real cave and there is more real measured points the sketcher may use to draw more real map. The software could use these auxiliary points for much more realistic 3D model of cave, etc., etc.

Martin.....exactly
Not sure how you enter these in Therion but in Walls from now on on our survey's the person with the SAP/Disto will record legs like

A1 to A2 1.6 159 -52 <0,1.5,4,2,c> Note: ,c in the LRUD data will generate a cross section drawing box when the SVG is exported from Walls and opened in Illustrator.
then
Auxiliary points:
A1 to a point about 1/2 way between A1/A2 on the left wall and then another from A1 to a point about 1/2 way between A1/A2 on the right wall....giving the sketcher the LR at A1 & A2 plus two other wall reference/draw points between A1 and A2.
In big rooms or on longer shots we would at our discretion add additional wall shots.

Mark Passerby, InCaveDigitalSurvey.com

[cavescom]

Mark: Once again,thank you for the massive amounts of data and effort you share freely on a constant basis!

I am going to buy one of these units.I assist on some surveys that need extreme accuracy (conserving lands through ANSI etc)and some scientists were wondering if the unit can be brought down to a half a degree accuracy.Do you think this is something that would be possible?For my own surveys one degree is fine as I doubt human eyes (or at least mine) will do any better with Suunto's etc.

I would stand by what the SAP site states mainly because we are using Suuntos to create the calibration file. It would be interesting to calibrate the SAP using "Big Boy" tools to generate the calibration file.

Mark

[Lava]

...
frees up the sketcher so that the labor is more balanced and the
survey moves forward at an even pace for all involved.

But...but...but... that'd be like Picasso letting a few mere mortals fill in a few spots on one of his beautiful paintings!

Hmmmm. The map of cave is DOCUMENTATION of cave not an artwork as I understand it.
Martin

Well obviously I believe my sketch to be a more accurate document of the cave than most sketches I've seen.

[LWB]

[quote="cavescom"][quote]
I would stand by what the SAP site states mainly because we are using Suuntos to create the calibration file. It would be interesting to calibrate the SAP using "Big Boy" tools to generate the calibration file.
Mark[/quote]

I have calibrated my Pony with a Total Station. The average error calculations from the PonyTrainer didn't seem much better than when calibrating with a Suunto, which surprised me. I've been getting average errors in the 0.36 to 0.41 degree range with the latest cals (after realigning the laser in the Pony, and using a jig to hold the Pony during calibration). I was running 0.44 to 0.47 degree average errors before.

I do have a closed loop survey, actually several loops, but one appears to have a distance error (misread the disto?) in a 3 station survey, that I hope to be able to go back and check. The "good" loop is just over 500 feet, horizontal UVE of 0.02, vertical UVE of 1.65. Horizontal loop closure error of 0.5 ft, vertical loop closure error of 2.9 ft (Horizontal Length 485.9, vertical length 65.5). It was not a flat survey (a cutaround to a domepit complex with several routes back into the main passage). The survey included one 45 degree and one 80 degree elevation shot, and quite a few shots above 10 degrees.

Survey included foresights and backsights - agreeing within one degree.

I did not have any angles in my Pony calibration course above 22 degrees, which likely affected the accuracy of my high vertical angle shots. I recently tried to add some steeper stations to the course, but I was unable to get Suunto readings I felt were accurate enough to use for calibration. I guess I will wait for the Total Station to add some.

The survey looked like this:

[url=http://www.postimage.org/image.php?v=aV1M2xJ9][img]http://www.postimage.org/aV1M2xJ9.jpg[/img][/url]