PMI Pit Viper

[David Grimes]

I am upgrading my caving harness and I am considering a PMI Pit Viper what does everyone that has used it think of it.

Is it comfortable?

Is it a good choice for a frog system?

Is it functional?

[Herman Miller]

This was my first and only harness I've used on a regular basis so take this with a grain of salt

as for being comfortable it isnt though for the multi drop caves its great having a harness that you can crawl with as it adds nothing to your profile.

Personally I havent seen a better harness for the frog system, a frog set-up benefits greatly from having a low attachment point which climbing harnesses just dont deliver and alas the viper does.

functionally I dont think it could get much simpler, you have some real light padding in the thigh area and "2?" gear loops on either side.

I do hope this helps you in your decision.

[fuzzy-hair-man]

There's another thread around dealing with this topic, have a look for it....
<EDIT> Here's the link:
http://forums.caves.org/viewtopic.php?t=5759&start=0&postdays=0&postorder=asc&highlight=

I have a Pit Viper and I like it, it's my first and only harness so far but I can compare it to the Petzl Fractio and SuperAvanti although I haven't used the superavanti I have seen one in the flesh...

The webbing on the Pit Viper feels lighter weight than the Petzls (both) and Pit Viper doesn't have the protection for the waist buckle (which is something I'd like and my harness does get some wear in that area)

The closest harness I know of to the Pit Viper is the superavanti, I initially went for the Pit Viper because:
# it's attachment point LOOKED lower (doesn't mean it is)
# it was marginally cheaper than the superavanti
# every other bit of vertical gear (just about) that I had was petzl and I wanted a change.

All up the Pit Viper has been good and is a nice minimalist frog harness. For my next harness I'd probably go the superavanti (or something from MTDE Picos or Amazonia) because I think the webbing is thicker, the wear protection on the waist buckle, I think the wear protection around the leg loops on the Petzl harness is better (The pit viper's is slightly stiff and there are some spots where it's worn where it folds the petzl's seems more flexible and the leg loop protection on the clubs fractios haven't worn as much as my Pit Viper's)

On the con side I'm still not convinced that the attachment point on the superavanti isn't higher.

I don't like the Petzl fractios at all, the yellow waist loop is useless and the metal loops (for me) allow the D maillion to rotate no matter how tight my harness.

The strap under your bottom on the MTDE harnesses is essentially the big difference that I see between the Pit Viper / Superavanti and the MTDE harnesses, I could see how this would make long periods on rope more comfortable though

[ek]

My grotto maintains a lot of loaner gear and we just recently bought a (large size) PMI Pit Viper because we have some people who are too big even for the larger ("size 2") Petzl harnesses. Petzl's Size 2 goes up to 41in waist circumference and 28in thigh circumference. The large-size PMI Pit Viper goes up to 55.1in waist circumference and 29.5in thigh circumference.

I haven't used it but those of us who have used it have had no complaints thus far.

[Jeff Bartlett]

i recently purchased one and like it. it's simple, light, and well-made.

it's definitely not the most comfortable frog harness out there - the OR1 Goliath wins that one, i think. but the attachment point is quite low, and one thing i have noticed is that it holds my half-round flatter to my body than the Petzl Fractio or the OR1 Goliath. the leg loops stay put nicely.

keep in mind that my opinion is based solely on some practice with these harnesses, and i am yet to bring the pit viper in-cave.

[CaverCraig]

i recently purchased one and like it. it's simple, light, and well-made.

it's definitely not the most comfortable frog harness out there - the OR1 Goliath wins that one, i think. but the attachment point is quite low, and one thing i have noticed is that it holds my half-round flatter to my body than the Petzl Fractio or the OR1 Goliath. the leg loops stay put nicely.

keep in mind that my opinion is based solely on some practice with these harnesses, and i am yet to bring the pit viper in-cave.

Agreed, the pit viper is very uncomfortable but good for frogging. However, the pit viper is very trimmed and easy to cave in. I would recomend the OR1 goliath frog for comfort, but it is a bit bulkier. You may want to check out the GGG seat harness IMO sells them for cheap. A fellow caver friend just got one and he says its more comfortable than the viper and just as trimmed. Good luck
Craig

[Jeff Bartlett]

i've since had the chance to spend some time on rope in-cave with it, and it's fine unless you're just sitting in it for 5 minutes or more - in which case i dare say almost every frog harness becomes pretty uncomfortable.

and yes, it's very low profile, light, and holds the maillon flush to my body.

it's exactly what it is - a minimalist frog harness like the superavanti or the GGG frog. it's very well made and a good value.

[GypsumWolf]

I am upgrading my caving harness and I am considering a PMI Pit Viper what does everyone that has used it think of it.

Is it comfortable?

Is it a good choice for a frog system?

Is it functional?

I used it at first and it worked, but I prefer the OR1 Frog Goliath harness (more comfortable). (But it is more $$).

[Bill Putnam]

I have a Petzl Super Avanti that I have used for many years and a PMI Pit Viper that I bought several years ago when they were first introduced. They are very similar in design and function.

The Petzl is a little more compact and has more sophisticated details (it's French) but is more expensive (it's French). Both are reasonably comfortable, but you would not want to sit in either one for an extended period (say, more than 30 minutes.) But when would you want or need to sit in any lightweight caving harness for more than 30 minutes? If you do, you need a different kind of harness.

These harnesses are designed to work best with the Frog system, but can be used with the Ropewalker or Mitchell systems just as well. Either would be an excellent choice for general caving. GonzoGuanoGear has a similar harness that also works well. Other vendors make or sell their own variations on the same design.

My main gripe with most of them is that you must adjust the leg loops to be very tight fitting, or they will tend to droop down behind your knees when you crawl, then interfere with your movement when you stand back up. This can be fixed by attaching a keeper strap from the back of the leg loops to the back of the waist belt.

That being said, the Pit Viper is an excellent harness at a reasonable price, made in America by a well-known and reputable manufacturer with ISO 9000 certification, a liberal return and exchange policy, and an 800 number for professional customer service. What more could one ask?

Bill

[fuzzy-hair-man]

I have a Petzl Super Avanti that I have used for many years and a PMI Pit Viper that I bought several years ago when they were first introduced. They are very similar in design and function.

The Petzl is a little more compact and has more sophisticated details (it's French) but is more expensive (it's French). Both are reasonably comfortable, but you would not want to sit in either one for an extended period (say, more than 30 minutes.) But when would you want or need to sit in any lightweight caving harness for more than 30 minutes? If you do, you need a different kind of harness.

These harnesses are designed to work best with the Frog system, but can be used with the Ropewalker or Mitchell systems just as well. Either would be an excellent choice for general caving. GonzoGuanoGear has a similar harness that also works well. Other vendors make or sell their own variations on the same design.

Bill any idea on which of the Super Avanti or the Pit Viper has the lower D maillon / attachment point? by the time I get a Pit Viper sent here to Australia it's about the same price so this is about the only thing that decides me one way or the other. I do find it interesting that more caving harnesses don't have the leg adjustment buckles on the inside thigh rather than on the outer leg where it's exposed to rub...

I currently have a Pit Viper but my next harness could be a SuperAvanti.
I've never had the PitViper leg loops (or waist) slip down on me... not sure what might be causing yours to slip down.

[Bill Putnam]

It seems to me as I sit here that there is not much difference between the attachment points, but I will have to get them out and try both of them on to be sure. I'll get back to you on that tomorrow.

Bill

[ljthawk]

Bill,

I don’t have any experience with the Pit Vipe, actually want to get one to try, but I hve used the Super Avante for years and have never had a problem with comfort, even on longer drops.

L.J.