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boogercaver71 wrote:I have a Vertex Vent too, but find it to be uncomfortable and 50 times harder to adjust.

I have both the first and second generation Vertex Vent. IMO, the first Vertex Vent with the adjustment wheel on the back strap is not very comfortable. It's hard to find a good fit, and once it is adjusted correctly the back strap tends to move around on the nape of my neck after a while causing the fit to become sloppy and allowing the helmet to start flopping around. That, plus the fact your head is positioned so far forward in the helmet with only some thin padding between the front of your head and the shell of the helmet.

Now, the Vertex Vent "2" is a totally different story. The "Center Fit" adjustment system is a thing of beauty. It has two adjustment wheels, one at each temple. These center your head inside the helmet so there's a good gap between the front of your head and the shell of the helmet. There's also not so much emphasis on making sure the back head band thing is in the perfect position, and it also stays in place much better. Overall, I think the Vertex Vent "2" is very close to being perfect.

I picked mine up at Karst Sports when they had the 18% off sale last December. I use my original Vertex Vent as a loaner now.

Smells_Familiar wrote:

boogercaver71 wrote:I have a Vertex Vent too, but find it to be uncomfortable and 50 times harder to adjust.

I have both the first and second generation Vertex Vent. IMO, the first Vertex Vent with the adjustment wheel on the back strap is not very comfortable. It's hard to find a good fit, and once it is adjusted correctly the back strap tends to move around on the nape of my neck after a while causing the fit to become sloppy and allowing the helmet to start flopping around. That, plus the fact your head is positioned so far forward in the helmet with only some thin padding between the front of your head and the shell of the helmet.

Now, the Vertex Vent "2" is a totally different story. The "Center Fit" adjustment system is a thing of beauty. It has two adjustment wheels, one at each temple. These center your head inside the helmet so there's a good gap between the front of your head and the shell of the helmet. There's also not so much emphasis on making sure the back head band thing is in the perfect position, and it also stays in place much better. Overall, I think the Vertex Vent "2" is very close to being perfect.

I picked mine up at Karst Sports when they had the 18% off sale last December. I use my original Vertex Vent as a loaner now.

Thanks for the info. I had not realized there was a generation 2

boogercaver71 wrote:Thanks for the info. I had not realized there was a generation 2

Neither had I - I've used an original Vertex on a few trips recently while trying out various Duo inserts I've been making, and I really hate the cradle/adjustment system on it - however I play with it, it seems to end up sloppier than my Ecrin even if tightened up uncomfortably.

Given my existing Ecrin is into middle age, I was about to go straight off and buy another one this weekend, but I guess I should at least have a look at the Vertex first.

actually I believe the primary difference between the "best" (ANSI and CSA rated)and the "vent" model is a higher electrical resistance and molten metal rating (the vent has holes...). Both are rated the same for high chinstrap retention.

The "ST" (no holes) has 1/2 the chinstrap retention strength and is designed to break away upon snagging. For caving applications I would argue that any of them would be fine.

The ST breakaway function might actually be preferred, as opposed to hanging suspended from your helmet in a narrow slot or snagged in a awkward crawl. Top impacts from rocks shouldnt affect it. I suppose it would be less desirable if being struck by multiple falling rocks exerting the equivent (I think) of 50lbs force each, especially glancing ones, but at that point things are gonna be bad either way

Smells

I just today received my second Vertex Vent, and it is second generation. I got the first one because it fit me better than an Ecrin. The new one, as you say, is better than the first generation - more comfortable, more vent, easier to open and close, easier to fit. Has a built-in blade mount, though that's a bit short for a Sten blade. (I'm thinking of cutting open the bottom of the blade pocket, rather than attach a mount.) If you try one on, remember to give the chin straps a tug down in the back after you put it on, to set them right. Very comfortable after that. (There's even a little picture of that in the instructions, hard to figure out unless you've done it.)

Dwight

I hadn't seen that there was a second generation Vertex Vent. This might be an option in the not-so-near future. My first generation fit poorly, so I leave it at a Wisconsin cave where I can't bring my other helmet. It sounds like they made some big improvements in that regard for the generation II. How does the blade mount work for those who have one, and what changes are being made to fit a Stenlight?

I still plan to buy a couple of Ecrins before they're gone (so, this weekend). My current helmet still has some time left, but the straps are showing wear and it's a bit beat up. I just replaced the foam in October, so I hope there's some life left in it.

Karst Sports just started a sweepstakes to win a yellow Ecrin Roc:

We are giving away a yellow Petzl Ecrin Roc helmet at the end of February to one lucky winner. To enter just click on the sweepstakes entry form on the left side of our fanpage. If we hit 7500 fans by 2/20 we will give away 2 Ecrin Roc helmets so make sure to tell all your friends to become a fan of our page which in effect doubles your chances of winning. You must be a fan of our page and a residence of the United States to be eligible to win.

Just visit their facebook @ http://www.facebook.com/karstsports

w00t w00t!

Just received my new Roc and tricked it out last night. Only thing missing is a Scurrion or Rude Nora....too much money
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Dwight Livingston wrote:Has a built-in blade mount, though that's a bit short for a Sten blade. (I'm thinking of cutting open the bottom of the blade pocket, rather than attach a mount.)

While I haven't done it to my vertex, I have seen other cavers do what you are suggesting with good results. Apparently it is a pretty easy job with a dremel.

Peter

Thanks, I was planning to attack it this evening, so it's nice to hear others have had success.

Dwight

Yahtaa wrote:Karst Sports just started a sweepstakes to win a yellow Ecrin Roc

Good, hopefully I will win since I have misplaced both my ecrin rocs. I hate to have to borrow a helmet to go caving. Unfortunately I have also misplaced my GPS and most of my lights as well, I guess they are all somewhere together in my house.

David Grimes wrote:

Yahtaa wrote:Karst Sports just started a sweepstakes to win a yellow Ecrin Roc

Good, hopefully I will win since I have misplaced both my ecrin rocs. I hate to have to borrow a helmet to go caving. Unfortunately I have also misplaced my GPS and most of my lights as well, I guess they are all somewhere together in my house.

David,
Sounds like you have become an armchair caver. Surely there are some good caves within driving distance.

Actually there are tons of great caves a very short distance from me right now since I am back in Harrison County Indiana. I was going on regular trips but then I started traveling for months at a time between Florida and Indiana. I have been spending a lot of hours working and my caving gear kind of got neglected. I actually have made plans all along to go caving in Florida and here in Indiana but something always seems to come up.

I have a little more free time now so I really want to get back underground soon.

I wonder if the withdrawl of Petzl Ecrin helmets only affects the US market. One of the well-known caving shop owners here in the UK who owns www.caveclimb.com says he has heard of this story via a US caver and when he checked with Lyon Equipment who are the Petzl distributors here in the UK, they said they have not heard anything about it from Petzl...

BrianFrank wrote:Just received my new Roc and tricked it out last night. Only thing missing is a Scurrion or Rude Nora....too much money
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Are those the only three lights you carry?