Cavechat.org

Please BOYCOTT Zebralight.


Request rescinded thanks to Boyce's infinite and inscrutible wisdom.

Speaking of side mount spot lights... Anyone have any recOmenxafions?
I'm currently running a fenix e21 on the side for backup. I'd like to replace it with a 18650 light.
Been looking into the jetbeam bc25. Max output is 650 lumen and max runtimes is over 7 hrs!

Got the green panasonics in. They are a bit shorter than the solarforces but they work in the zebra h600 and the spark st6 500cw. Only thing I am wondering. How long to these panasonics I got. And the 3100s. Hold heir charge. Are they like the eneloops where they hold the charge for a year or are they A high discharge battery.


And read the fine print on that 600 lumen light for 7 hours.
Guarantee it won't run on 600 lumens that long.

^ of coarse not. I believe I said max out put of 650 lumens and max runtime of over 7 hours. Not 650 lm for over 7 hrs. Wouldn't that be nice!

As far as batteries, I've been using Tenergy 18650's and 123's Checkem out.

DeanWiseman wrote:Please BOYCOTT Zebralight.

Too late... my H600w already arrived. Very quick shipping too. They even responded to my request for information within an hour. So far, not much of a reason to boycott. Maybe it'll be a horrible light that fails on me and then I can have a good reason to boycott Zebralight. We'll see...

Chads93GT wrote:Got the green panasonics in. They are a bit shorter than the solarforces but they work in the zebra h600 and the spark st6 500cw. Only thing I am wondering. How long to these panasonics I got. And the 3100s. Hold heir charge. Are they like the eneloops where they hold the charge for a year or are they A high discharge battery.

Again, I'm not a li-ion battery expert by far... but I'm learning. From what I've read, lithium batteries hold their charges significantly longer than most other batteries. A lot of people say that it's best to store lithiums not fully charged, and not fully drained either. Ah... just found the site where I heard this from: http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/how_to_prolong_lithium_based_batteries. According to these guys, a li-ion battery only permanently loses 4% of it's total capacity after a year of storage at 40% "state-of-charge" at room temperature. Store them in your fridge and they'll last even longer. Not bad... sounds like lithiums can last for an incredibly long time if you use them properly.

I did mention to be careful about putting those green cells in your Spark, right? Just sayin...

Caver John wrote:Anyone have any recOmenxafions?

Looks good to me. Not too familiar with all the options out there (I'm not much of a "spot" guy), but I will recommend that any light you think about buying you should go to candlepowerforums.com and search for posts related to that light. There's a very good chance someone will have asked the questions you are thinking, and there's a good chance you'll find out if it's a good light or not.

my neutral one showed up 3 days later.........

DeanWiseman wrote:
Please BOYCOTT Zebralight.

Zebralight may not always respond quickly to emails, but I got my H60Fw promptly after ordering and it has been completely reliable, even in very wet conditions.

Separate issue: I wish Zebralights were as flexible as Sparks in that you can convert the Spark to a flood by easily removing the reflector. I cave with the spot (reflector and no diffuser lens), but for photography, the flood setup is very good.

John

with both H600's.........i completely lit up the bottom of mystery falls, wall to wall, and could even see the top of the dome, although dark, but hell thats 280 feet up. my buddies lights that were 400 lumen + lights were no comparison. These things are stupid bright.

Chads93GT wrote:with both H600's.........i completely lit up the bottom of mystery falls, wall to wall, and could even see the top of the dome, although dark, but hell thats 280 feet up. my buddies lights that were 400 lumen + lights were no comparison. These things are stupid bright.

Told ya so! : )

Now all that is left is to see how well the H600 stands up to years worth of caving trips and water immersion.

Which color do you like better, the H600 or H600w? Of course the H600 is brighter, but is the H600w color more pleasing to the eye in your opinion?

rlboyce wrote:

DeanWiseman wrote:Please BOYCOTT Zebralight.

Too late... my H600w already arrived. Very quick shipping too. They even responded to my request for information within an hour. So far, not much of a reason to boycott. Maybe it'll be a horrible light that fails on me and then I can have a good reason to boycott Zebralight. We'll see...

RL, you don't get it: The point isn't to boycott when YOU have a reason, it's to boycott whenever ANYONE has a reason. Otherwise, the leverage one gets out of the threat of a boycott is lost. And... so the the next time you're feeling screwed, people don't just ignore your complaints. The other point to be made here: If they can't or won't resolve a simple issue like this in timely fashion, what happens when you try to call in a warranty? Or if the light goes off like a grenade on your helmet (hypothetical situation, yes), you have no options for recourse.


Miracle of miracles... When I got somebody on the phone at Zebralight, it was actually someone with enough clout to tell the Customer Service gal to pull her head out of the somewhere-the-light-don't-shine. They sent me a replacement (using uninsured USPS, again, for some unknown reason). Wow... I ordered this thing in October.

DeanWiseman wrote:RL, you don't get it: The point isn't to boycott when YOU have a reason, it's to boycott whenever ANYONE has a reason.

Applying this logic, wouldn't every single company in existence be boycotted?

I've had issues with product quality and customer service from an innumerable amount of companies over my lifetime. Never once did I ask that a person or multiple persons boycott an infracting company. In those cases I shared my experience and let people make up their own minds. Or is it incorrect to allow a person to construct their own judgements?

Okay, I get it. It was a bad experience. We've all read about it. Multiple times. Perhaps it's time to move on now.

If you are this disgusted, why are you accepting a replacement?

Propaganda is for absolutists with personal agendas.

rlboyce wrote:

DeanWiseman wrote:RL, you don't get it: The point isn't to boycott when YOU have a reason, it's to boycott whenever ANYONE has a reason.

Applying this logic, wouldn't every single company in existence be boycotted?

Okay, Mr. Semantic. I'll qualify my statement more to the point: Whenever anyone has a serious and legitimate reason.

Legitimate companies do things in an honest and forthright manner. Or as least they should. And if a company refuses to assist a customer on a trivial matter such as this, first taking customers' money then dropping them like a hot turd, then they should be given a message and a strong one. We're not talking a $5 or $20 issue here, either. So I chose to ask for help. Thanks for nothing.

Move on.

Megadome in Valhalla, lit up from my neutral tint H600, or whatever the newest one was that came in last week.

Looks like the Megadome just got owned by your H600w, haha! Thanks for sharing the pic.

Dean,

I sympathize with you, and would agree with you...except.....the real question is whether your experiance is unusual or does Zebralight have a history or reputation for bad service? At least based on Cavechat users the answer seems to be your experiance is not typical. Boycotting a company over 1 bad incident among many good ones? Now, if we suddenly find that Zebralight has a long list of customer issues in comparison to good ones then yes, I see your logic for trying to force a change in culture at Zebralight.

However, the better your product is, the worse your service can be. Everyone has horror stories about cable tv guys but we got cable anyway cause it was awesome. Zebralights so far seem pretty good. The reverse is also true. Great service can overcome a poor product.

I think of Princeton Tec and the APEX. It really was a pretty poor caving light. Virtually everyone who bought them and caved with them outside a desert had issues. Yet few boycotted this obviously poor light design because their cost was relatively low and their service was so good. I know several folks here on cavechat and in person who literally had them replaced over and over and over...for free.

so, dont expect sympathy for a boycott if there isn't a "pile of bodies" in customer service, or if their product is very good.