Flashlight mount to digital camera

[rlboyce]

Okay, so I've got an idea, but I'm looking for suggestions...

I take a fair amount of video clips with my digital camera, but when it comes to caves I can't really do that due to lighting issues. Yeah, caves aren't the best environment for a camera, but I have a camera that I'm not afraid of getting a little dirty (it's waterproof, I'm going to get a shock-proof case, and I'll make sure to keep the mud off of it... for the most part). I'm thinking that if I can find a way to mount my hand light onto my camera, it will enable me to take video in caves as well. I'm not looking for a superior quality setup or anything, just something that lights things up in the direction my camera is pointing.

So, I notice that my camera (and most others) have a threaded hole on the bottom for a tripod. I was thinking that I could find a 1/4-20 screw (standard?), attach it to a screw/band hose clamp (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hose_clamp) with j-b weld (... or something) and simply put a decent light in the clamp, tightening it down.

The advantage to this is that I should be able to put any kind of flashlight into it; if the beam is inadequate, I'd simply find a stronger light. The disadvantage would be limited adjustment if the beam was not pointing exactly where the camera was.

So, can you think of something that would allow for more adjustment (without turning the screw), or perhaps a setup someone else has come up with? Thanks.

[Chads93GT]

I can tell you this, even shooting video with my digital compact camera, with my modded apex on high, 150+ lumens, and my Fenix on turbo at 220 lumens, at the same time, still doesnt put off enough light to shoot good video.

You may want to rethink your not needing a "superior quality" light. The best way we have found to shoot video so far is with million candle power lamps with defusers made from plastic bowls, and then the batterys go dead in 10-15 minutes.

Just a little something to think about.

[rlboyce]

First off, thanks for the reply!

Hmmm... okay, I think this is getting into the debate of preference. I understand that if you want to see all of the cave well, a simple flashlight isn't going to do it for you. I've come to terms with that, and I'm quite satisfied with seeing what the camera (light) is pointing at, and having no peripheral view. For others, a flashlight for video illumination might be downright annoying, but for me I have no problem with it.

As for the Apex being insufficient, my 130 lumen seemed to do just what I needed in this video (please excuse the loud volume and general pointlessness of the video):

I don't know about you, but everything that the light touched I could make out very well. The two main problems with that video was that the camera was often pointing in a direction other than where the light was pointing, and sometimes the camera got in front of the light which caused a shadow. If I mount a flashlight correctly, I believe both of this issues would disappear.

I'm not saying you're wrong (in fact, I believe you're probably right), but I guess I'm one of those guys who finds things hard to believe until he tries it for himself. Perhaps when I mount it I can post a test video and let you judge the results? Hopefully it'll turn out as good as I hope.

[Chads93GT]

I think the main difference is everything around here is coatedi n magnesium oxide, or mud. It makes the caves extremely dark as neither color will reflect light at all for video taping. This is an example of what I mean. If I am not looking directly at the wall, you see nothing but darkness. Its horrible. One of those bad ass 1200 lumen flash lights is needed for better video for sure.

Edit: and the sheer size of the passage matters a lot if you just have an apex as well.

[rlboyce]

LOL... "still going..."

Yeah, I 100% agree with you about passage size. I was in a small crawlway when I took that video; things were close, and that's why things were mostly illuminated. There's little doubt my opinion of a flashlight mount to a camera would change if I brought it along to the cave from the video. Heck, there were times in your video where I couldn't see a thing, and I'm sure that there may be a few caves up my way where it would be the same way. I guess you could say I've formed a new opinion now: my flashlight mount idea might work, but it would be unwise to try and use it in a big room.

[Chads93GT]

Yeah, big room would damn near be impossible without tons of lighting. Hell, look at the rumble room photos, lol. the passage in question here was only about 6' wide due to that flow stone, but the wall over the vlowstone was still 10 or 15 feet away, but still you get the point. it was long river passage, dark and gloomy. our head lamps look great on our heads, but behind a video camera, they just arent bright enough. hopefully you find something that will work.

[NZcaver]

My 2 cents. I used to drag a Sony handycam and (big) underwater housing along with me on caving trips before discovering the meaning of the word "cumbersome." This was in the early 2000's. I had a small vehicle spotlight mounted to the tripod socket underneath, powered by a small sealed lead-acid gel cell.

More info in this post.

I've found that my little Canon point and shoot in its waterproof housing works pretty well for shooting in caves. I use my regular headlamp(s) for lighting. The Apex on spot beam is a little tight but it's OK except when doing closeups. The Zebralight is a good flood for closer shooting. The spot/flood combo in my modified Duo (similar setup to a Sten) also worked really well. The big difference is that I try to film PEOPLE doing stuff in caves (usually rescue training) - not just the cave itself. Not only do human subjects light up better (reflecting more light than many cave walls), but cavers also have their own lighting sources. Plus they provide scale and interest in each shot, and a semi-stable image to follow as you move around the cave so viewers don't get motion sick quite so fast.

Here's a few of my videos. Don't know if this helps, but you could try some different shooting techniques and see what happens.

[WVCaver2011]

I had a 1 million candlepower spotlight that I took into a cave, that I used to work on a while back, and after taking a video all I could see was a circle where the central beam of the spotlight hit. So what I did was get a 2 million candlepower spotlight and it helped, but it still didnt work well enough for the nearly black walls of the cave. The only difference was that the beam was a little wider.

I also took the same 2 million candlepower spotlight into a cave that had tan colored walls and the lighting was too much for the camera, making everything white. So I figured out that I could use my Apex on high through the crawlway and pick up an efficient amount of detail although something just 30 lumens brighter with a wider beam would have showed everything!

I also took the same spotlight into a larger part of the cave and noticed that the beam was too bright in the center so I would assume that if I could find or make a defuser the light would be spread over a large enough area for me to even capture most of canyon passages and some of the smaller rooms. If I could find a wider beamed spotlight of the same candlepower and stick a defuser on the end of that I think I would have a decent set up for making a nice video.

So, in conclusion, I would say that just one lighting source probably wont do the job very well because different passages can make an influence on how your videos turn out. Use something with lower power in tighter spaces and something with higher power, with a wider beam, and a defuser in wider areas such as canyon passages. You may need something even brighter with an even wider beam for those big rooms.

[rlboyce]

Makes pretty good sense to me. Lighting requirements will undoubtedly change with a changing environment. I just need to go to the hardware store with light and camera in hand, seeing what might work as I walk down the aisles. Anything's possible with enough experimentation and testing.

[agosnell]

Hid lights may be the way to go with larger passage...

[Jon]

IF you can get replacement lenses for those killer spotlights and or narrow beam flashlights here's what you do. Take the spare lenses to a machine shop and have them dust them lightly and far away with the glass bead machine. This will give you frosted optics much like a Sten 7. It is important that they work at a distance and with the air turned down a bit. You can really soften up the hot spots this way. DO NOT try this without a good supply of replacement lenses. Too close and or to much air pressure and you may get too much frosting also the the jet must be kept moving. A good way to check the pattern of the flow would be to lightly spray paint a scrap of sheet alum. also a good idea would be for them to sift the medium prior to beading your lenses, any rust scale or other stuff will put a good gouge in the lens and make for uneven light. If spare lenses aren't available then cut some lexan covers and frost them. Note I didn't say plexiglass as that is way harder to cut without shattering.

Having several variations of frosting will allow you to adjust light to fit your needs. Hope that helps

[YuccaPatrol]

Cheap, simple and reversible way to frost a flashlight lens: satin scotch tape

Flashlight nuts at www.candlepowerforums.com have been doing it for years

[Jon]

Yep it will frost em with tape BUT on a high heat, high powered light the stickum will bake on. Also you will get visible lines from the seams and if not perfectly aligned there will be gaps which will give hot spots. Any air bubbles or folds will cause uneven light. Overlaps will give darker areas. Plus it is going to be hard to change frost levels on the fly in a cave. If you want the right thickness Lexan cheap then fine a race car fabrication shop. If they do asphalt cars or drag strip only cars there will be scraps from windshields and windows that can be had for free or almost free. If the lens covers are made larger than the light they can be taped in place (outside the area of illumination) allowing quick changes of frosting levels. VERY repeatable.

[rlboyce]

Well, I finally got a chance to try my idea out. It turns out that some of your suspicions were correct. The Apex works, but it doesn't work for shooting distances any greater than about 20 feet. As the caves I normally visit don't have that much space, mounting my light to the camera does exactly what I need it to do. I did some experimenting and also found that certain cameras work better with this setup than others.

Here's a video with the mount on my waterproof camera in a larger cave:


For some reason, my non waterproof camera takes better video with the same light, which was taken in a smaller cave:


Yes, the two younger individuals don't have the proper equipment on. No, I do not advocate "spelunking" without the proper equipment. Yes, myself and the other caver were smart enough to wear ours. The two young guys were actually the owners of the cave, and there was basically no way I could prevent them from going in without the right equipment. According to one of them, they've visited the cave more than once before. On the positive side, after witnessing each of them hit their heads on more than one occasion and my pointing out to them how much that had to hurt, I'm sure it'll be easier to convince them to use the right equipment from now on. Normally I wouldn't post this video here due to the amount of criticism I'll likely receive for taping their reckless abandon, however it seemed worth it in order to show you how well the Apex mount works under the right conditions.

[Leclused]

I don't no much about how many light ouput is required for a good video. But we (SC Avalon) shoot often small clips just with our headlamps. Ok most of the members of our club use a Stenlight or Scurion, so the light output is not that bad.

IMHO I think it should be possible to make a good clip with just your headlamp.

An example clip with some hightlights of lasts years expedition (Anialarra - PSM, France/Spain):

http://dl.getdropbox.com/u/1068395/Movi ... zonder.wmv

our complete videozone :
http://www.scavalon.be/avalonnl/videozone.htm

A tip when shooting with a digital camera and your headlamp is the following : Always hold the digital low enough. Do not hold the camera on eye-level. When you keep the camera on eye-level your headlamp will shine on the camera which creates a camera shaped shadow on your video.

Br

Dagobert L'Ecluse (Belgium)