NZcaver wrote:Mudduck wrote:...I carefully scolded and corrected him and needless to say shyed away from taking him anywhere anytime soon...
I say take him caving, and watch him closely.
A little cave conservation education, a little appreciation for his surroundings, who knows? He may even become a caver.
You sound, if I may say so, idealistic. An admirable trait, were the stakes not so high.
I agree with part of your statement, but with a difference. Until that person in question demonstrates cave conservation ethics, and remorse for his actions, I wouldn't let him near anything, supervised or no. I'd always be worried that he'd come back after the fact and do in my absence what he wouldn't have the balls to do in my presence. Or just simply wait until my back was turned, then do whatever he felt like doing. I wouldn't even do it if the cave in question was gated. Because if he was smart enough to find his way back to the gated cave, then he is also probably smart enough to find his local Home Depot and buy a pair of bolt cutters to get in after the fact. However..... We have a cave near where I live that is very well known, and heavily visited over the years, and by all the wrong kinds of people. Subsequently, over the years, it became rather heavily trashed out. Pretty much, if it could have been reached by a can of spray paint, it was coated in fluorescent colors. If a hand could be put on it, it was broken off. Beer cans and liquor bottles abounded. Bats were deliberately killed en masse. All the worst behaviors in caves that we all are too, unfortunately, well acquainted with. Nothing could be done about it, because the owner, a caver, believe it or not, allowed it. In time, it became what is known as a "sacrificial cave", a cave that the owner would allow to be destroyed in order that other caves would be spared. In theory. Guess what. It didn't work. The poison just simply spread to other nearby caves, on other people's property where the *sshats could find themselves a bare patch of rock to leave their own mark where it could be more easily seen by anyone who came by. After awhile, there were no good spots on the walls left, I guess, in the "sacrificial cave". Because that was what it was all about, really, on the bottom line, I think. Leaving your mark where everyone could see it where no-one had ever done so before. Territorial p*ssings, as it were. For probably the same reason why other jerks climb the freshly painted town water tower to spray paint their message to the world on the side of the holding tank.
The cave was pretty much, a lost cause. However, it did still serve a constructive purpose, as far as I was concerned. A garishly spray painted and ugly bad example. When I met someone who expressed an interest in caving, if I had doubts or they gave me any reason to suspect the content of their character, for whatever reason, I would take them to that cave. Then, I'd take them on a tour of the worst this cave had to offer. God knows the owner didn't care a lick. And I would watch them. And listen to them. Closely. If the person showed genuine dismay, if not outright horror at the waste of a perfectly good cave, then I knew the person might be worth bringing to a good cave, after they had heard the conservation rap. God knows they were owed one at that point. If they did not show the appropriate reaction
, I knew they were not to be trusted.
Because, my experience has taught me that some people are just plain evil, thoughtless, and beyond reclamation. Sociopaths. They can and will say whatever they believe you want to hear to get them what they want. And seem perfectly sincere. And you don't want to be the one to lead them to a nice cave and later find out that they have done the unthinkable. They might not do it on the trip where you give them the keys to the kingdom to all the wonders of the underground, but what's to stop them later? Without you. And if that happens, you'll never be sure if the dastardly deed was done by your novice, or not.
It sounds like I am being paranoid, doesn't it? Like I should be more trusting of my fellow man. Or does it? Leave it to say that I have actual, factual and concrete reasons for feeling this way. You can do all the right things, and still be the indirect instrument of destruction by someone in your group. Trust me. It happens.
Is this really necessary? Really? Ok......