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Re: Word to describe small "caves"

PostPosted: Oct 8, 2009 5:23 pm
by Spike
Macropore comes to mind, doen't have the entrance part your looking for. "Small cave like features" gets the idea across but s unwielding and informal. If your trying for a one small size fits all term for these features any where then good luck, we can't even agree what exactly a cave is. If you're workng with a specific NPS park then I would just take the time and describe the features objectivly. If they are 1 meter diameter solution cavities then say that. If the features are .5 meter diameter voids in soil from soil piping then go with that. Good luck. Anyway let us know what you decide on.
Spike

Re: Word to describe small "caves"

PostPosted: Oct 8, 2009 9:51 pm
by Teresa
Every small hole in the wall less than 20 ft I've ever mapped and turned in was called a "karst feature". At one time (pre-Spike *|;-)) the Missouri Speleological Survey was doing the calling. At one point, there was a paper file of these things and it was labeled "karst features".

I know, technically a sinkhole or a natural tunnel or a spring is a karst feature also; this use of karst feature seemed specific to the survey field.

Cavelet? I vote for cavelet. :grin:

Re: Word to describe small "caves"

PostPosted: Oct 9, 2009 5:59 am
by Squirrel Girl
Spike wrote:Macropore comes to mind, doen't have the entrance part your looking for. "Small cave like features" gets the idea across but s unwielding and informal. If your trying for a one small size fits all term for these features any where then good luck, we can't even agree what exactly a cave is. If you're workng with a specific NPS park then I would just take the time and describe the features objectivly. If they are 1 meter diameter solution cavities then say that. If the features are .5 meter diameter voids in soil from soil piping then go with that. Good luck. Anyway let us know what you decide on.
Spike

I like it--SCaLF.

Joints and overhangs aren't karst, so any reference to karst doesn't work for me.

Re: Word to describe small "caves"

PostPosted: Oct 9, 2009 8:54 am
by tncaver
How about grotto, vug or alcove.

Re: Word to describe small "caves"

PostPosted: Oct 9, 2009 9:08 am
by Squirrel Girl
tncaver wrote:How about grotto, vug or alcove.

Grotto has too much of a karst implication to me. I had been using "vug" but my boss (and other remote sensing types) think it's an acronym that needs defining. And is secondary porosity. Alcove is a word I use a lot. But verbally people don't understand what I'm saying. I'd be happy to include vugs and alcoves in my personal acronym of SCaLFs, though SCaLF may encompass all pretty simply.

Re: Word to describe small "caves"

PostPosted: Oct 9, 2009 9:40 am
by tncaver
SCALF isn't a word in my 1960 version of Webster's dictionary. But neither is CAVER. :kewl:

Re: Word to describe small "caves"

PostPosted: Oct 10, 2009 5:48 am
by Squirrel Girl
tncaver wrote:SCALF isn't a word in my 1960 version of Webster's dictionary. But neither is CAVER. :kewl:

SCaLF in a newly described acronym. Caver is a word, in the dictionary or not!

Re: Word to describe small "caves"

PostPosted: Oct 10, 2009 7:16 am
by Jagdmann
How about SOC/SOCs ( Small Open Cavities ), this would be assuming that anyone using this particular acronym in context would be familiar:tonguecheek:with what the definition is.

Re: Word to describe small "caves"

PostPosted: Oct 10, 2009 7:31 am
by tncaver
Squirrel Girl wrote:
tncaver wrote:SCALF isn't a word in my 1960 version of Webster's dictionary. But neither is CAVER. :kewl:

SCaLF in a newly described acronym. Caver is a word, in the dictionary or not!


I agree. CAVER is a word. That was my point. :agree: If enough people use SCaLF, it will eventually become a word too. :clap:

Re: Word to describe small "caves"

PostPosted: Oct 10, 2009 11:55 am
by wyandottecaver
I actually like the SOC's idea.....

Re: Word to describe small "caves"

PostPosted: Oct 10, 2009 7:49 pm
by Cheryl Jones
:yeah that: :wtg:

Re: Word to describe small "caves"

PostPosted: Oct 10, 2009 9:29 pm
by Teresa
Squirrel Girl wrote:
Joints and overhangs aren't karst, so any reference to karst doesn't work for me.


But both joints and overhangs (aka "rock shelters" in the original post) "may" be karst, though they aren't necessarily so.
if one said karsted joint or karst overhang, those could be correct.

Re: Word to describe small "caves"

PostPosted: Oct 10, 2009 9:38 pm
by Teresa
"Vug" is already defined in the AGI Glossary-- "a small cavity in a vein or rock, usually lined with crystals of a different mineral composition from the enclosing rock." Vugs are geodes, ore-lined cavities in host rock mines, or even a crystal pocket in a hand-sized rock specimen.

Vug not good, because dissolution features can be entirely naked of crystal linings.

However, two entries below is: "vuggy porosity. " "Pores in sedimentary rocks that result from dissolution of the rock. Vuggy porosity ranges in size from pin point to cavernous."

I'm not sure that even the lumpers amongst us would put a granite joint, an ore-lined vug, a solutioned volcanic breccia, holey, mud-sucking-vermin-track ridden limestone and glaciated potholes into the same bag just because they all are vacant space.

On the other hand, we could call it all "airspace." Or how about: "geospace"? :clap:

Re: Word to describe small "caves"

PostPosted: Oct 11, 2009 9:38 am
by Wayne Harrison
Cavelet.

Re: Word to describe small "caves"

PostPosted: Oct 11, 2009 12:20 pm
by Jagdmann
Wayne Harrison wrote:Cavelet.


SOC :boxing: :rofl: